Shock collars - I need to pursuade someone not to use......

[kalija]

Hi, I am hoping someone can provide me with links or references for the negative affects of the use of shock collars. I have a friend who has been told by another friend that shock collars are the best training tool out there, and she is seriously considering using one on her dog. The dog is just untrained, in my opinion, no real problems, just stuff like counter surfing, jumping up ect. Nothing an obedience class and consistent training methods wouldn't help with. I am trying to convince her that this is not the way to go, but I need Facts, studies, that kind of thing. I know there are a lot of you out there that only use positive methods, and have kept me from going the aversive route - so I hope someone knows where I can find some solid info? Thanks for any help!

[SpringerLover]

I don't know if there are studies or hard facts... only stories.

I can vouch for it being in the wrong hands... and UNTRAINED hands is just cruel to the dog. It will not teach them ANYTHING other than to fear the collar. It may seem like the dog "knows" then but they are just on constant alert at that point.

It is simply dangerous and stupid to use one without proper training of YOURSELF. Other than that, it's unnecessary. We had one, long story short, it almost ruined my dog. I will NEVER use one again. We have some issues that may be "easily fixed" by it (recall issues from lack of training when he was growing up) but I refuse. There ARE other ways if you are dedicated.

Something that has the same "effect" as a shock collar (and is noticable to the dog like an improperly used shock collar) is a long line. I bought 50' of rope from Tractor Supply along with a clip. We are set. You can cut it to varying lengths for use in the house, you can keep it long or get a longer one for use outside.

It's one tool that used improperly won't damage a dog like a shock collar will.

[Rivsky]

I also don't have any studies or anything but I completely agree with SpringerLover.

Try and either steer your friend towards an obedience club which uses positive training methods or get her to read a book about how to become "pack" leader - Jan Fennell's the Dog Listener isn't a bad read.

[Dogsareme]

Tell her not to us it.

She could use it at the wrong time and ruin her dog, or give him worse problems then she is prepared to handle. Say her dog barks alot at kids walking down the street, and everytime her dog starts to bark at the kids walking down the street he gets zapped and it causes him lots of pain. After awhile her dog will start to think Kids = Pain and may either become aggressive towards them or very scared and show fear aggression towards them. This is just one of the many scenarios that can happen with a shock collar. They are dangerous expecially to someone who does not understand how to use them properly. Even to someone who knows how to use them properly they are dangerous and should be used with percaution.

[Carrie]

http://www.apbc.org.uk/article2.htm

There's a link which Sammy posted on another thread.

I think a shock collar is a ridiculous way to "train" a dog....more like intimidate a dog and make the poor animal neurotic.

[Pondwader]

In addition to other suggestions that have been posted, one thing that may make people think twice is to tell them to try it on themselves.
I will never use one on my dogs, low shock my butt! It HURTS... My ex wanted to use it on my dog once, he "accidentally" whacked my bare leg with it and the shock was so intense I felt sick for a couple hours.
I kept the dog, he kept the collar...

[Sugardog]

There are so many things that can go wrong it's not even funny.

They can teach the dog to become fearful of people, other dogs, practically any object, heck, even their shadow. It can cause a dog to break down emotionally.

I've seen shock collars used on dogs. The dog yelped and flinched and I even winced myself seeing it. I even saw a dog bite and snap at the air, trying to get the pain to end. I personally couldn't handle that emotionally and the person operating the control got told off pretty well. They actually got rid of the dog and thank goodness! So yes, shock collars can cause aggression.

If the dog isn't damaged emotionally, then the person operating the remote can become a "bully" and it can make further training of the dog more difficult. If you use punishment on a dog, it must be swift and concise and it must match the crime. It's common for a dog to basically get used to a correction. The dog will start reasoning that the action he wants to do is worth the shock. Now the intensity of the shock will have to be bumped up for it to remain effective. A smart dog will also learn that it's the collar that is correcting him, not the owner. The result of this? He will only behave if he has that collar on. He could care less what the owner says or wants, all he knows is that the collar being off means freedom and he's going to take full advantage of it.

Another thing that could happen which goes under the category of emotional damage is something similar to supersitious behaviors and learned helplessness. This occurs with improper training. If it isn't clear what the dog is being zapped for, he'll find a reason for it and associate the zap with something else rather than what the owner is actually zapping the dog for. This is how the owner can create fears of objects, dogs or people with a shock collar. For example, if she zaps for jumping up but is consistently late with her timing, she will not be teaching the dog not to jump. If by chance the dog sits down after it jumps and thats when she zaps it, she has just disciplined the dog for doing exactly what it should be doing, sitting when people enter a room! And if not that, then the dog could associate the zap with a person if the dog was looking at a person when it happened. If she zaps too early, she is disciplining the dog for coming over and greeting her and she'll soon have a dog that is afraid of her. If the collar is over used, the dog may not be able to figure out what it can do to avoid the shock, especially if there isn't any proper training with the shock collar. This creates learned helplessness. The dog can't figure out how to avoid the shock, so he won't think there's anything he CAN do, thus he is helpless and will take the shock rather than learning how to behave to avoid it.

[Jamila]

If she gets a shock collar ask her to wear it and see how she likes it.


I know people are laughing in this video but seriously look at how the guy reacts to the shock.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0ffIyxiLxc

[mom2cocoa]

I sure hope she changes her mind. I feel so badly for dogs, being at the mercy of us humans.

[Sugardog]

Actually there is one really good use for a shock collar if it's used correctly.

Have your friend put it around her neck. Now whenever the dog does something bad, zap her for not watching the dog!

[Pondwader]

Originally Posted by Sugardog

Actually there is one really good use for a shock collar if it's used correctly.

Have your friend put it around her neck. Now whenever the dog does something bad, zap her for not watching the dog!

[kalija]

Thanks guys, I am sending the links and having her read this. Hopefully this will pursuade her.
I can imagine how many mistakes you can make with timing something like that. Heck, I have a hard enough time with clicking in time to mark a behavior, but at least I can't permanently damage him if I miss with the clicker!!!!

[ginastags2315]

I think shock collars are cruel. They should never be used on dogs, especially because most people who use them shock their dog every few minutes. I would never consider using a shock collar on my dogs. I've always used positive reinforcement to train them.
I'm trying to persuade my sister and her fiance not to get one of those mats for dogs that shock them. Their yard is fenced in, but there's an opening in front of the driveway, so they can't let their dog out unless he's on a leash and someone's out there with him. Her fiance wants to put a shock mat across the opening for the driveway... my sister doesn't want to, but she wants to be able to let their dog out on his own. I told them that they should just put a gate across the opening and park in the street, but they still don't know what they're going to do.

[flyndog]

E. Schalke, J. Stichnoth, and R. Jones-Baade Stress symptoms caused by the use of electric training collars on dogs (Canis familiaris) in everyday life situations. Current Issues and Research in Veterinary Behavioral Medicine, Papers presented at the 5th Int'l IVBM. Purdue University Press, 2005:139-145. [ISBN 987-1-55752-409-5;
1-558753-409- 8]

Schilder MBH, van der Borg JAM. Training dogs
with the help of the shock collar: short and long term behavioural effects. Applied Animal Behaviour Science 2003;85:319-334).

Polsky, Richard (Dr. P) Can Aggression in Dogs Be Elicited Through the Use of Electronic Pet Containment Systems? Journal of Applied Animal Welfare Science 2000, Vol. 3, No. 4, Pages 345-357

Juarbe-Diaz SV, Houpt KA. Comparison of two antibarking collars for treatment of nuisance barking. Journal of the American Animal Hospital Assoc. 1996 May-Jun;32(3):231-5.

Overall, Dr. Karen, Appropriate Use of Shock Collars

(Dr.Overall ran the behavioral clinic at Univ. of Penn's Veterinary Hospital for 12 years and about 5 years ago moved to the Center for Neurobiology and Behavior at Penn Med to focus on research. She is an Applied Animal Behaviorist, the author of "Clinical Behavioral Medicine for Small Animals" and numerous articles on behavioral medicine and is an international lecturer.)

"Electronic shock collars receive a lot of attention, but are probably overused (Polsky,1994). The two basic types are those that act remotely in response to a stimulus (most bark collars) and those that are triggered by a hand-held unit. Shock can help any animal that can learn to avoid the object of focus. Timing is critical, and shocks should be instantaneous, and of just the right intensity to startle the animal so that it will abort the behavior and seek another replacement behavior.
Inherent in this is teaching the dog a more appropriate behavior and rewarding spontaneously good behaviors. Remote-sensing bark/shock collars do not permit the latter two steps to occur. Those triggered by a hand-held unit should be used only in extreme circumstances, in the absence of other solutions, and only by clients who understand and are willing to comply with the amount of behavior modification involved.
These clients are rare, and this should never be a first-choice option. Shock collars are seldom used correctly, are more often overused or inappropriately used, can make any aggressive animal more aggressive, and may tell us more about people who feel that they have to rely on them than about the pet's problem, perceived or real.

Read an open letter by Dr. Overall at joelwalton.com/shockcollars.html

The International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants (IAABC) is currently putting together a study, but is not out yet. Their latest Journal edition is due out soon.

A lot of this stuff is out there in the public domain now on the Internet.

[briarlow]

Luckily it looks as though our country will be banning them shortly, can't wait!