Dog aggressive on leash/in car

[muggsmom]

Hi everyone,

I need to pick your brains.

Muggs is 2 1/2 yr old Shar Pei/Eng. Pointer. He was neutered at 8 mos. Went to doggy daycare from 5 mos to 15 mos. Has been to obedience classes.

He is dog aggressive when he is on the leash or in the car. Goes absolutely ballistic when he sees or hears another dog. However, he is OK when friends with dogs come to the house, or with the dog across the road. Once we were visiting friends, had him out on the leash and there were 2 dogs across the road. He was pulling, jumping, barking, etc. and the leash broke. He raced across the road to the other dogs and was fine. They did the greeting thing (he was a little more tense than I would have liked), but he was fine. When my knees could hold me I went and got him and as soon as we were almost home he started carrying on again. It's not that he wants to play because he has gone after unleashed dogs that approach him.
My ex lives in an apt. building, there are 4 other dogs in the building. When we visit I have to watch and time our outings so we don't encounter any of them. Then there are the dogs we encounter on our walks. Needless to say, this is making life difficult.

He goes from 0 to 10 in 0.25 secs. Totally zones me out, I can't get him to do anything. The nearest trainer in our area is 2 hrs. away.

Help!!!

[Cherokee]

The first problem is that you are so worried that he's going to do something you're giving off a negative energy. You're the follower in your little pack unfortunately so he's going to do what he wants.

First thing I'd suggest is getting him on a leash any time he's around other dogs...making sure to do a lot of good quality walks with him so the leash doesn't become a negative thing.

At any sign of agression, and I mean ANY sign of agression a quick upward pop on the leash as a correction should cool down the situation. As long as you realize the change won't be instant, it'll take time. Just make sure you're the leader of the pack, and not the dog...be calm, stop worrying, you're in control remember

*Edit*
By the way, I'd invest in a good leather leash, it's not going to break on you then.

[Sophie45]

Why don't you contact one of the trainers from obedience class?
It sounds like he is maybe possessive of you and the car...?

I would strongly recommend reading the booklet by Patricia McConnell called "Leader of the Pack", "The Other End of the Leash" or really anything by her-she is absolutely brilliant.

Her website is http://www.patriciamcconnell.com/

You can get them cheaper on Amazon, probably.

[Cherokee]

I really don't think contacting a trainer will help her much...she just needs to get control of her "pack" first of all, with that the situation might get under control very very easily.

[Kuchi]

Is he food driven? My dog used to go crazy when a dog walks by across the street, I've been using the command leave it and walk really fast with him opposite side the dog is closest on. I have a treat in my hand so he focuses on the treat and not the dog. Those nasty looking lamb lungs work great for this because you can keep breaking them apart. Now he will look, with smaller dogs he's gets more excited. If he walks by without a bark I praise him A LOT! And give him treats. If he does bark or lunge I say No, direct his attention, walk faster and say let's go (excitedly) I found if you don't say let's go excitedly it just doesn't work as well as saying let's go when you have irritation in your voice. If he's toy driven, then bring toys. I've tried this with a clicker and I was just holding too much while trying to control him, so I just do treats.

Oh and that is a good book, but you don't remember her teaching this in details.

[Ritz459]

With my dog aggressive Lab, I did a combination of what Kuchi and Cherokee suggested.
First, I made sure Blackie's obedience training was very good. I went dog obedience in 4H with him where he learned sit, stay, down, stand, heel, come, and where working on "leave it" and "let's go" was highly essential.
After he was heeling and "leave it"ing (lol) 99.9% of the time, I tackled his dog aggression. (Actually, having him in the class on leash around other dogs worked WONDERS with his dog aggression.)

When I took him out on a walk and a dog started barking at us (or we were in class and a dog walked close to us), I made sure I was paying attention to Blackie. I would have him in a heel at my side nibbling on a treat. If he would start to look to stare down the other dog, a quick pop with his Slip Collar and a firm "Leave it" command, followed by TONS of treats and praise when he looked back at me did the trick.

Now if we are out on a walk and we encounter a dog barking at us or another dog on leash, a short tug on Blackie's collar and a "heel" command is enough to get him to ignore the other dog.

If it is at all possible, I would say to enter him into a dog obedience class where he will HAVE to be on leash around other dogs. This would be a controlled setting where he will learn that he can't lunge and bark at other dogs.
If you have already done this and he is fine in an obedience setting, try taking the formality of an obedience training ring to your walks. Give him a job to do on your walks (heeling, frequent sitting, down/stays) so he is focused on that and not on the other dogs.


With Rose, my fear aggressive dog, I did what Kuchi suggested. When she would start to act aggressive because she was scared, a happy "Let's go!", walking off at a brisk pace, and continous praise was enough to jolt her back to reality and happily catch up with me.

[borzoimom]

I agree with the above and let me add a little about car aggression. Dogs can be aggressive in the car for several reason- * trying to control the environment of a moving vehicle or theirs, * fear as feeling traped in a confined space, * territorial dominance.
** trying to control the environment is handled with two people. One with the dog leashed in the car and when the dog start to act controlling- correct the dog but in a firm but calm voice.
** fear of trapped spaces- this is hard. Any dog that feels corned if bad enough can be aggressive. However- once the dog is told to silence the dog should accept what you said.
** territorial dominance - the dog thinks they are in charge- and not you.
I would suggest getting a local trainer or behaviorist to give you a hand..

[muggsmom]

Wow!! Thanks for all the input.

I thought I had myself under control while we were out, but I guess by constantly watching for the other dogs, I was still sending out bad vibes. I have the rest of the "top dog" under control, I think. I go out doors first, make him sit and wait for food/water, heel on walks, not allowed on furniture, etc.
I do snap the leash any time his ears go forward, his walk changes, he pulls, etc., but he just ignores me. I use a Halti because it's the only way I can control him when he goes off, but I have to use everything I have to turn his head away from what he's focused on.
He is food motivated, but he totally ignores me when he's zoned out. I haven't found anything yet that will get his attention - not even cheese!
The trainer we used for obedience is no longer training - which is a good thing!! Her method was "One style fits all, and I will use whatever force I have to to get you to submit to me." Some of the dogs were so scared of her they shut down if she even looked at them. Luckily, she didn't focus too much on Muggs. She was the only trainer in our area, and I didn't know how bad she was.
I wish I had a video so I could show you just how fast he goes off.
I will try your suggestions, and definitely get Patricia McConnell's books.

Thanks for all the input. Definitely appreciated!!

[Cassiepeia]

In addition to what others have said...have you tried changing direction quickley when he reacts? I mean...say you're walking down the street, he spies a dog, starts to react and you quickly turn around and walk in the other direction until he calms down. Then when he's calm, turn him back around (with lots of praise) and continue as you were before (changing direction again if he reacts)?
Teaches him that if he reacts he doesn't get to go where he wants. Just another option to try.

Cass.

[muggsmom]

Yes, that's what I do if we see a dog on the street. Unfortunately, there is only one entrance into the apt. building, I we have to pass by one dog that is tied up outside. It's very difficult to get him to go anywhere, he usually on his hind legs trying to get through me to the other dog.

It must have something to do with the leash. There is an elderly gentleman with a small terrierX, that he always carries in and out of the building. Muggs is at his absolute worst when he sees them. He even goes off if he just sees the man. I think Muggs just assumes that he's carrying the dog and doesn't even stop to check. However, today we were on our balcony (2nd floor) and they walked by. Muggs was looking down at them and didn't react at all!! Nothing. Just watched them walk into the building. Actually, the man stood there for a couple of minutes laughing and shaking his head.

I don't get it!

[Cassiepeia]

Did you reward him for being so calm? Could he have not reacted because you were very relaxed? He may be taking his cues to react off you if you're a bit tense or nervous everytime a dog is around when you're out. He might think "Uh oh...mum's nervous so I should be protective".

Have you tried a 'no pull' harness instead of a head collar? Do you practice obedience with him everyday? Perhaps introduce your dog to the neighbour he barks at (the man) and get the man to feed him treats? Reward him whenever he doesn't bark at the man.

I'm concerned that you snap the leash when he's wearing a halti collar, I believe the 'leash pops' are used for dogs wearing a standard collar or check chain (could be wrong on that though). "Popping" the leash of a dog wearing a halti seems dangerous (to the dog's head and neck).

You really need to find someone who can see you in real life and see what's going on. It's difficult to see the whole picture online.

Sorry for being a bit scatter brained in this reply. LOL

Cass.

[trainingrixie]

cass is right about the head collar...you can cause neck injuries by popping a head collar. the whole point of it is that it is self correcting. when they pull, it makes them turn their head. I also like cass's crazy owner idea too....changing directions when he acts up. it makes him focus on what you are doing. i think a combo of the crazy owner and Kuchi's idea would be pretty successful. and if that doesn't work with time and consistency...i'd contact a pro

[Ritz459]

Isn't there a book that focuses on dog aggressive dogs? For the life of me I can't remember what it is called...but I'm sure it would have something in on it about leash aggression.

[muggsmom]

I do praise him a lot when he calms down. I haven't used a harness because I heard that they can encourage pulling. When I have the halti on I also have his choke collar on and they are connected together. The pop I give is just enough to make a noise with the choker, not to bring his head around. Even with the halti, I have to physically turn his head with my hands, he is so strong and if Muggs doesn't want to turn his head away from what he's focused on, he won't.
When I took him on his 15 min. "pee walk" this morn. I changed directions everytime he focused on the usual spots we run into dogs. Our 15 mins. turned into 1 1/4 hrs. He's a very determined boy.
I spoke to a behaviourist this morning. They come to the house and work on teaching me to be pack leader. She also suggested the "about face". They work with us in the house, the car, and go on walks. Only when he is doing well looking to me for direction will she introduce the distractions. The only problem is the cost - $400. It will take me a while to save that, I'm hoping no more than 6 wks. Obviously I'm giving off vibes that I'm not aware of, and my timing is probably off too. I need to get this fixed before someone gets hurt - I couldn't live with that. Not to mention that Muggs will be a much happier dog, he can't be very happy if he's stressed so much. Amazing that something that seems so simple - Relax and change your attitude - can be so difficult to accomplish.

Thanks a bunch for all the ideas but mostly the support. You are a super bunch of people. I'll keep you up to date.

[Ritz459]

I'm glad you were able to contact a behaviorist! Hopefully she will be able to help you and Muggs learn to conquer this problem.