I need advice with my dog and her new puppies.

FISSY · 01-16-2007, 07:21 PM

hello everyone. i am new to the site and hope to be around for along time. i do have a problem and i hope someone can easy my mind. i have 2 chesapeake bay retrievers..male is " goose " and is 3 years old. Female is Day-z and she is 2 1/2 years old. I breed them not long ago..and now i have 10 new puppies..as of 1-09-2007. I was so ready for this. It being my first time with a female dog every. I read everything about the breeding and the stages of whelping..and so on. but to my suprise...i didn't read anything or not find anything of why the female hates the pups. I mean she whelped them...didn't take them out of the sac..or anything..she just snarled at them as she expelled them.
now after a week of holding her down to let them nurse every 2 to 3 hours..she still hates them. Can anyone tell me if they have ever been through this or heard of it. I'm so bummed..not cause i have to do everything for the puppies..but cause she is really confused..i think...she wants to be with them..and she is content laying on the floor in the room but can't be left with them un attened...we know that cause sunday she grabbed one by the head and then dropped it. She hurt it. Well any advice would be great. thanks everyone.

felicity

***Cassiepeia*** · 01-16-2007, 07:32 PM

Sorry to hear you're having problems. We have several very experienced and knowledgable people on here who should be able to help you.

For everyone else...can we please keep the 'why did you breed' questions until Felicity's questions have been answered?

Cass.

FISSY · 01-16-2007, 07:51 PM

it's ok.. i breed the dogs so that our friends could have great hunting dogs from us. I planned one breeding her only one time. Out of the 10 pups we have...7 are spoken for. We do alot of goose and duck hunting in north dakota..with alot of friends..and they just love the way our dogs hunt. I also know these people very well..and they will give the dogs great homes. Like our dogs..they are a huge part of our pack. They live in the house with us and go to work with us. They are great dogs and very social. Even though i'm having a hard time with the mom...i'm not sorry. I will give them all my attention every hour of the day till they are ready to go if i have to. I just didn't expect the bitch to dislike them the way she does. So any comments are welcome and thank you Cassie

***Rivsky*** · 01-17-2007, 12:26 AM

I don't know how to fix it - or if it is something that can even be helped - but I do know some bitches just aren't natural mothers - my sister just got a border collie that was planned on being used to breed from - however she just wanted to play with her puppies instead of looking after them so she wasn't considered a "good" mother to them (which is how she ended up with my sister).

britishbandit · 01-17-2007, 01:24 AM

I've already mentioned this to you in chat Felicity, but I'll mention it "officially"....LOL, on your post.

Holding the mother down to feed the pups isn't the best plan, and I really think bottle feeding (since you say you are home all the time anyway) is a better plan. If she allows them at some point, then great, but not if you have to hold her to do so. Also there are 10 pups, which is VERY demanding on her, so even if she is feeding them, it's a good idea to bottle feed as well to make sure they are all getting enough.

Crossfire Bulldogs · 01-17-2007, 06:45 AM

I agree with British. Mother's milk is always best the first few days of life but after that in my opinion really serves no purpose that would make it better than a ready made or homemade milk sub.

Yes, it is better if the pups are with the bitch for obvious bonding purposes etc... however, if a bitch has to be physically held down just to nurse the litter then what real purpose does it serve? It's a huge risk to the litter as it only takes a split second for something to happen. Those pups aren't going to stay slow moving for long.

My advice, bite the bullet and bottle feed those little ones before mother injures another pup or does much worse. If I can help at all in getting you started with a homemade milk recipe or advice on how to bottle feed correctly just let me know.

FISSY · 01-17-2007, 08:17 AM

ok..thanks to everyone. I have started to bottle feed the puppies. I want to clear something up though. I don't have to like fight the bitch to nurse. She comes in the room with me by least..then she lays down for me really well. The puppies begin to nurse and she goes right to sleep. Heck..then I just sit and make sure she doesn't try anything with the pups. One really great thing..is she is so " what ever" asleep, dazed, or relaxed..that i can cut her nails which she hates anyways. But anyways. I am now bottle feeding the puppies and i'm very comfortable with that. They are 8 days old and I weigh them every morning and evening. They started out at 10 ounces..and most of them are weighing in at least 2 lbs and over.
Although I do have one more question...so here goes.

I spend alot of time in the room with them..feeding, cleaning and just sitting watching...enjoying them. I notice that when I leave the room to get something and they are awake...when I return...they are like trying to nurse on each other...ummm...ya know as in sucking on the other penis. So i'm thinking that can't be good at all...I have been doing my best to get them fed and comfy before that happens but it seems it still happens a little. I'm sure its cause they don't have the mom to suckle on when they feel like it?????? And is this going to cause them problems???

I'm sorry if I'm coming off as if I don't know about these things..but I was totally ready for this litter...just was taken back 100 feet when she reacted the way she did. I do know that she will not be apart of there puppy life. I'm the mom and thats ok...and btw..the one she did grab...is acting normal again. Though I am keeping a close eye on him. So thanks again for all your help and advise.
Felicity

12weimgirl · 01-20-2007, 07:49 PM

I'm sorry your having all these problems..... but I'm not sure what to do about that last question.....

Lauren

mrsgrubby · 01-22-2007, 11:39 AM

I am sorry your bitch has neglected the puppies. I have heard of this happening. The most important thing now is to keep the puppies together. I know people will try to convince you that they can go home starting at 5 weeks old because they will have been weaned, but please keep them together until they are 8 weeks old no matter what others say.

The skills and behavior they will learn from eachother is very, very important to them, especially since the mom isn't teaching them anything. They will learn play, bite inhibition, communication, some socialization, and more. They will also get past their first fear period together which is good.

Hang in there, keep bottle feeding them, and keep them together till 8 weeks old.

keekers · 01-25-2007, 11:45 AM

wow- that is really too bad about the mom. hope everything works out. i know nothing on that subject but like previously said definitly keep them together until 8 weeks. poor things..breeding sounds like a lot of work!!!! take care...

FISSY · 01-25-2007, 12:03 PM

Thanks for all the help...Oh you can bet that they are not leaving me until they are at least 8 weeks old. I no they need each other...and that is one of my huge worries....that the mom is not teaching them anything. I mean that is really important...I use a warm cloth to stroke them with as though it's like a mothers tongue..and i sniff them alot...lol..sounds strange i'm sure...but my adult dogs to that to me all the time...The mom will come and put her face near mine and then sniff...so i let her and then she lets me do it to her...lol...so I do that with the pups...might mean something! I do know that i'm not going to make them poop and pee like she should be doing...but i do it with warm wet cotton balls...lol. Thank works just fine!

Vanilla · 03-17-2007, 11:05 PM

I had a foster dog and her puppies one time and Brandy (mom) neglected the pups.I would try and get her to nurse them,not hold her down or anything,just bring the pups to her or crate her with them...but she just did not wanna be with them.She then stopped producing milk and the pups died.This was awhile ago,before I realized I could of helped them.I know alot more now!

Anyway I am glad that they are doing better with you as their mommy.Any pictures?

Vanilla · 03-17-2007, 11:05 PM

Oh and I think suckling is normal.I have heard it is anyway.

calgal · 03-18-2007, 11:19 AM

Not all animals have maternal instincts. Could you maybe let the puppies nurse from the mom either first thing in the morning or last thing at night? May help the mom from becoming engorged, and satisify the pups nursing desire.

01-16-2007, 07:21 PM	#1 (permalink)
FISSY fissy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: northern Wisconsin Posts: 48 Rep Power: 0	I need advice with my dog and her new puppies. hello everyone. i am new to the site and hope to be around for along time. i do have a problem and i hope someone can easy my mind. i have 2 chesapeake bay retrievers..male is " goose " and is 3 years old. Female is Day-z and she is 2 1/2 years old. I breed them not long ago..and now i have 10 new puppies..as of 1-09-2007. I was so ready for this. It being my first time with a female dog every. I read everything about the breeding and the stages of whelping..and so on. but to my suprise...i didn't read anything or not find anything of why the female hates the pups. I mean she whelped them...didn't take them out of the sac..or anything..she just snarled at them as she expelled them. now after a week of holding her down to let them nurse every 2 to 3 hours..she still hates them. Can anyone tell me if they have ever been through this or heard of it. I'm so bummed..not cause i have to do everything for the puppies..but cause she is really confused..i think...she wants to be with them..and she is content laying on the floor in the room but can't be left with them un attened...we know that cause sunday she grabbed one by the head and then dropped it. She hurt it. Well any advice would be great. thanks everyone. felicity

01-16-2007, 07:32 PM	#2 (permalink)
*Cassiepeia* Chihuahua Mum Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 8,281 Blog Entries: 9 Rep Power: 286	Sorry to hear you're having problems. We have several very experienced and knowledgable people on here who should be able to help you. For everyone else...can we please keep the 'why did you breed' questions until Felicity's questions have been answered? Cass.
	__________________ Say NO! to animals in pet shops. Rescue a friend instead: Petfinder Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Book Club ~ Blogs ~ Art Classes ~ Woof Review As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

01-17-2007, 12:26 AM	#4 (permalink)
*Rivsky* Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: South Australia Posts: 3,869 Blog Entries: 6 Rep Power: 145	I don't know how to fix it - or if it is something that can even be helped - but I do know some bitches just aren't natural mothers - my sister just got a border collie that was planned on being used to breed from - however she just wanted to play with her puppies instead of looking after them so she wasn't considered a "good" mother to them (which is how she ended up with my sister).
	__________________ As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

01-17-2007, 01:24 AM	#5 (permalink)
britishbandit Rottweiler Mum Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Windsor, ON Posts: 4,185 Rep Power: 180	I've already mentioned this to you in chat Felicity, but I'll mention it "officially"....LOL, on your post. Holding the mother down to feed the pups isn't the best plan, and I really think bottle feeding (since you say you are home all the time anyway) is a better plan. If she allows them at some point, then great, but not if you have to hold her to do so. Also there are 10 pups, which is VERY demanding on her, so even if she is feeding them, it's a good idea to bottle feed as well to make sure they are all getting enough.
	__________________ "No matter how little money and how few possesions you own, having a dog makes you rich." - Louis Sabin

01-17-2007, 06:45 AM	#6 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 287	I agree with British. Mother's milk is always best the first few days of life but after that in my opinion really serves no purpose that would make it better than a ready made or homemade milk sub. Yes, it is better if the pups are with the bitch for obvious bonding purposes etc... however, if a bitch has to be physically held down just to nurse the litter then what real purpose does it serve? It's a huge risk to the litter as it only takes a split second for something to happen. Those pups aren't going to stay slow moving for long. My advice, bite the bullet and bottle feed those little ones before mother injures another pup or does much worse. If I can help at all in getting you started with a homemade milk recipe or advice on how to bottle feed correctly just let me know.
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~ Gerry Spence As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

01-16-2007, 07:51 PM	#3 (permalink)
FISSY fissy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: northern Wisconsin Posts: 48 Rep Power: 0	it's ok.. i breed the dogs so that our friends could have great hunting dogs from us. I planned one breeding her only one time. Out of the 10 pups we have...7 are spoken for. We do alot of goose and duck hunting in north dakota..with alot of friends..and they just love the way our dogs hunt. I also know these people very well..and they will give the dogs great homes. Like our dogs..they are a huge part of our pack. They live in the house with us and go to work with us. They are great dogs and very social. Even though i'm having a hard time with the mom...i'm not sorry. I will give them all my attention every hour of the day till they are ready to go if i have to. I just didn't expect the bitch to dislike them the way she does. So any comments are welcome and thank you Cassie

01-17-2007, 08:17 AM	#7 (permalink)
FISSY fissy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: northern Wisconsin Posts: 48 Rep Power: 0	ok..thanks to everyone. I have started to bottle feed the puppies. I want to clear something up though. I don't have to like fight the bitch to nurse. She comes in the room with me by least..then she lays down for me really well. The puppies begin to nurse and she goes right to sleep. Heck..then I just sit and make sure she doesn't try anything with the pups. One really great thing..is she is so " what ever" asleep, dazed, or relaxed..that i can cut her nails which she hates anyways. But anyways. I am now bottle feeding the puppies and i'm very comfortable with that. They are 8 days old and I weigh them every morning and evening. They started out at 10 ounces..and most of them are weighing in at least 2 lbs and over. Although I do have one more question...so here goes. I spend alot of time in the room with them..feeding, cleaning and just sitting watching...enjoying them. I notice that when I leave the room to get something and they are awake...when I return...they are like trying to nurse on each other...ummm...ya know as in sucking on the other penis. So i'm thinking that can't be good at all...I have been doing my best to get them fed and comfy before that happens but it seems it still happens a little. I'm sure its cause they don't have the mom to suckle on when they feel like it?????? And is this going to cause them problems??? I'm sorry if I'm coming off as if I don't know about these things..but I was totally ready for this litter...just was taken back 100 feet when she reacted the way she did. I do know that she will not be apart of there puppy life. I'm the mom and thats ok...and btw..the one she did grab...is acting normal again. Though I am keeping a close eye on him. So thanks again for all your help and advise. Felicity

01-20-2007, 07:49 PM	#8 (permalink)
12weimgirl Join Date: May 2006 Location: Kentucky Posts: 539 Rep Power: 60	I'm sorry your having all these problems..... but I'm not sure what to do about that last question..... Lauren
	__________________ Lauren

01-22-2007, 11:39 AM	#9 (permalink)
mrsgrubby Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 2,476 Rep Power: 146	I am sorry your bitch has neglected the puppies. I have heard of this happening. The most important thing now is to keep the puppies together. I know people will try to convince you that they can go home starting at 5 weeks old because they will have been weaned, but please keep them together until they are 8 weeks old no matter what others say. The skills and behavior they will learn from eachother is very, very important to them, especially since the mom isn't teaching them anything. They will learn play, bite inhibition, communication, some socialization, and more. They will also get past their first fear period together which is good. Hang in there, keep bottle feeding them, and keep them together till 8 weeks old.

01-25-2007, 11:45 AM	#10 (permalink)
keekers Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 231 Rep Power: 49	wow- that is really too bad about the mom. hope everything works out. i know nothing on that subject but like previously said definitly keep them together until 8 weeks. poor things..breeding sounds like a lot of work!!!! take care...

01-25-2007, 12:03 PM	#11 (permalink)
FISSY fissy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: northern Wisconsin Posts: 48 Rep Power: 0	Thanks for all the help...Oh you can bet that they are not leaving me until they are at least 8 weeks old. I no they need each other...and that is one of my huge worries....that the mom is not teaching them anything. I mean that is really important...I use a warm cloth to stroke them with as though it's like a mothers tongue..and i sniff them alot...lol..sounds strange i'm sure...but my adult dogs to that to me all the time...The mom will come and put her face near mine and then sniff...so i let her and then she lets me do it to her...lol...so I do that with the pups...might mean something! I do know that i'm not going to make them poop and pee like she should be doing...but i do it with warm wet cotton balls...lol. Thank works just fine!

03-17-2007, 11:05 PM	#12 (permalink)
Vanilla Doggy Foster Mommy Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Newfoundland Posts: 304 Rep Power: 49	I had a foster dog and her puppies one time and Brandy (mom) neglected the pups.I would try and get her to nurse them,not hold her down or anything,just bring the pups to her or crate her with them...but she just did not wanna be with them.She then stopped producing milk and the pups died.This was awhile ago,before I realized I could of helped them.I know alot more now! Anyway I am glad that they are doing better with you as their mommy.Any pictures?
	__________________ R.I.P Chelsea. Forever in my heart. Let a Greyhound Race into Your Heart!

03-17-2007, 11:05 PM	#13 (permalink)
Vanilla Doggy Foster Mommy Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Newfoundland Posts: 304 Rep Power: 49	Oh and I think suckling is normal.I have heard it is anyway.
	__________________ R.I.P Chelsea. Forever in my heart. Let a Greyhound Race into Your Heart!

03-18-2007, 11:19 AM	#14 (permalink)
calgal My Yorkster kids! Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: central ca. coast Posts: 6,882 Rep Power: 234	Not all animals have maternal instincts. Could you maybe let the puppies nurse from the mom either first thing in the morning or last thing at night? May help the mom from becoming engorged, and satisify the pups nursing desire.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)