OK....I'll start it: Is dog racing cruel?

KennelMom · 11-30-2006, 03:40 PM

Do you think dog racing - specifically greyhound racing - is cruel?

Just for giggles, we'll include both amateur racing (lure coursing, oval track, straight line - only ribbons earned, no money) and 'professional' racing (pari-mutuel wagering is involved)

Now...please be specific as to why you feel the way you do

Sugardog · 11-30-2006, 03:50 PM

I don't think it's cruel.

All sighthounds were born to run. They just love doing it. Denying one of those breeds the opportunity to run is more cruel than putting them in races! I have a whippet mix and running is her favorite activity.

Border collies were bred to herd and having them herd isn't cruel, bloodhounds were bred to track, and having them follow a scent isn't cruel and greyhounds were bred to run so letting them chase after a fake rabbit in a lure coursing event certainly isn't cruel.

The only way I see it becoming cruel is if it becomes not for the dogs enjoyment, but for human entertainment and the dogs become abused or neglected. Like if the dog is alive soley for racing purposes and doesn't get to also live a life as a loved housepet.

TribalRats · 11-30-2006, 03:59 PM

We have actually had a very similar discussion in the past re: racing RACING THREAD (Should we do away with the races?)

KennelMom · 11-30-2006, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TribalRats

We have actually had a very similar discussion in the past re: racing RACING THREAD (Should we do away with the races?)

That was a thread as to whether or not racing should end. This is a thread about whether or not people think the sport in and of itself is cruel. Subtle difference, I'll grant you that

***Cassiepeia*** · 11-30-2006, 05:34 PM

What is your opinion on it KennelMom and why? We need that before this is a legitimate debate.

Cass.

KennelMom · 11-30-2006, 05:46 PM

OK...my opinion. Dog racing is not cruel. I think it's an exciting sport that both humans and dogs enjoy...that goes for both kinds of racing.

I think the breed thrives on the routine of racing and the most stressful time of their life is usually going into a pet home. That said, I think every retired greyhound deserves, and should get, a home when their racing days are through.

I think that just like any other animal sport or activity, you can have some bad apples who are in it for the wrong reasons and sometimes the animals suffer. That's wrong regardless of the sport/industry/breed.

We are *hopefully* going to be buying our first racer (puppy) in the next month or so. We're considering a couple litters right now. Our first racer will most like come home to us. Future racers, who knows...but they will ALL be guaranteed a sofa with a family when the time comes.

Of course, we do lure coursing with our current pet greys and will do that as long as they are sound and enjoy doing it.

AgileOllie · 11-30-2006, 06:18 PM

My opinion is this:

In every dog sport there are dogs who are abused and taken for granted. I think that a dog who is bred to do a specific task should be excercised in that task, if they have a drive for it. Border collies should herd (or perform in agility, etc- whatever to keep their minds sharp) Dachshunds should go to ground, sight hounds should run.

I don't know much about greyhound racing, so I can't say whether the CONDITIONS are cruel or not, but the acutal activity of running is what they were bred to do.

Every sport - even conformation- can be cut-throat and there can be bad apples.

My motto is- if my dog ain't having fun, then it's not worth it for either of us.

Does that make sense? I have a tendency to ramble

Crossfire Bulldogs · 11-30-2006, 10:04 PM

I can only go by what I've heard from you KennelMom about it changing over the years and I do so hope that's the case.

My own experiences with the tracks go back more years than I care to mention, my grandparents were huge fans and would drag me along often to watch the races. They actually owned several racers for a number of years. I remember seeing some very cruel things, dogs shot and dead dogs laying in piles at kennels away from the track just to name a few. I would like to be open minded enough to go back to a track and see for myself how they are now but don't think I could ever bring myself to do it.

My past experiences from years ago left a very bitter taste and to this day I guess you could say I still hold a grudge. However, I am grateful to anyone who takes in retired racers and gives them a wonderful second chance at living the home life.

***Rivsky*** · 11-30-2006, 10:50 PM

I agree - if the dog loves it and the conditions in which it lives and races are good then there's no harm. I've never actually been to greyhound races before so I can't comment too much on it but I do believe the dogs get a real kick out of it.

Like many others my one proviso on this is as long as once the dogs are retired they are allowed to lead happy, comfortable lives and are not put to sleep or neglected then I personally have no problem with the sport.

Novel · 12-01-2006, 12:26 AM

I've never been to a greyhound track, although one still remains here in Wisconsin. I pass by the one in Iowa often on my way too and from shows. I've always wanted to stop, but dislike betting and gambling in any form, and so would not feel right even visiting the track.

But as far as the actual sport. With the usual exceptions, I see nothing wrong with it. I find it exhilirating to watch horse races, and only imagine that dog races are very similar.

rottielover · 12-01-2006, 05:14 AM

If you do it for fun with your friends yes, can be anything like agility or OB, but I totally disagree with the bigtime racing, where the poor things are stuffed in tiny cages, and are only used for making money the discareded once they are done

KennelMom · 12-01-2006, 06:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rottielover

I totally disagree with the bigtime racing, where the poor things are stuffed in tiny cages,

Have you ever seen the crates they are kept in at the track? If so, which track and which racing kennel?

Quote:

and are only used for making money the discareded once they are done

Do you have a philosphical problem with people making money off of animals or is it that you have a problem with people owning a dog for a period of time and then finding it a home?

rottielover · 12-01-2006, 06:30 AM

I have seen many retired greyhounds, that have been adopted from big tracks. I have an issue as they are only there for racing. They do not have a home to call their own, until after their racing career.
I have a problem with people making money off these poor creatures. Such as betting, not like prizes to be won.For the winner. Same goes for Conf shows.
I understand some COE breeders also after they retire a bitch, prefer to place in a pet home due to they will have more time with love, and one on one basis. But to all honest with you I do not agree with that either. This is just my opinion. Everyone has there say.
This is something I have read on GRa-america not my words
During a greyhound's racing career he or she may stay at one track or be moved from track to track a few times to find a competitive niche. There are several grades of tracks around the country (a little like professional baseball -has major and minor leagues) and each track has numerous kennels. The details of the routine from one kennel to another may vary slightly but for the most part will be about the same as the example given above--not enough difference to be that noticeable by the dogs.

This is what is alittle unsettling to me

Kuchi · 12-01-2006, 06:30 AM

The sport of running is fine. But I don't like gambling on an animal. I'm okay with prizes to the winners, but for the crowd to bet I don't like. Its the same with horse racing I don't think betting should be involved and just prizes.
I don't have a problem with people making money off their dog, but it should be given as 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place prizes. Money from the crowd is unnecessary to me.
I still don't know enough about the races, if most are created equal, etc. As with the crates, thats not a problem with me as long as the animal can turn around in it.
So with that I don't have an answer with the races themselves just no betting.

rottielover · 12-01-2006, 06:38 AM

not saying it is a bad sport, as I said can be compared I guess to agility and OB, if the dog loves it, he/she loves it. I just do not agree with the lifestyle it leads on the track

11-30-2006, 03:40 PM	#1 (permalink)
KennelMom Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Piedmont, SC Posts: 658 Rep Power: 83	OK....I'll start it: Is dog racing cruel? Do you think dog racing - specifically greyhound racing - is cruel? Just for giggles, we'll include both amateur racing (lure coursing, oval track, straight line - only ribbons earned, no money) and 'professional' racing (pari-mutuel wagering is involved) Now...please be specific as to why you feel the way you do
	__________________ Heather and the hounds Visit our pack at GreyhoundFreaks.com In loving memory of my Bridge Babies: Star, Annie, Casino, Erin ~ kitty Simon ~ fosters Dagger and DV

11-30-2006, 03:50 PM	#2 (permalink)
Sugardog Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 266 Rep Power: 48	I don't think it's cruel. All sighthounds were born to run. They just love doing it. Denying one of those breeds the opportunity to run is more cruel than putting them in races! I have a whippet mix and running is her favorite activity. Border collies were bred to herd and having them herd isn't cruel, bloodhounds were bred to track, and having them follow a scent isn't cruel and greyhounds were bred to run so letting them chase after a fake rabbit in a lure coursing event certainly isn't cruel. The only way I see it becoming cruel is if it becomes not for the dogs enjoyment, but for human entertainment and the dogs become abused or neglected. Like if the dog is alive soley for racing purposes and doesn't get to also live a life as a loved housepet.
Sugardog Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 266 Rep Power: 48

11-30-2006, 03:59 PM	#3 (permalink)
TribalRats Take Responsibility Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Central Valley, CA Posts: 3,327 Rep Power: 141	We have actually had a very similar discussion in the past re: racing RACING THREAD (Should we do away with the races?)
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

11-30-2006, 05:34 PM	#5 (permalink)
*Cassiepeia* Chihuahua Mum Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 8,250 Blog Entries: 9 Rep Power: 280	What is your opinion on it KennelMom and why? We need that before this is a legitimate debate. Cass.
	__________________ Say NO! to animals in pet shops. Rescue a friend instead: Petfinder Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Book Club ~ Blogs ~ Art Classes ~ Woof Review As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

11-30-2006, 05:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
KennelMom Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Piedmont, SC Posts: 658 Rep Power: 83	OK...my opinion. Dog racing is not cruel. I think it's an exciting sport that both humans and dogs enjoy...that goes for both kinds of racing. I think the breed thrives on the routine of racing and the most stressful time of their life is usually going into a pet home. That said, I think every retired greyhound deserves, and should get, a home when their racing days are through. I think that just like any other animal sport or activity, you can have some bad apples who are in it for the wrong reasons and sometimes the animals suffer. That's wrong regardless of the sport/industry/breed. We are hopefully going to be buying our first racer (puppy) in the next month or so. We're considering a couple litters right now. Our first racer will most like come home to us. Future racers, who knows...but they will ALL be guaranteed a sofa with a family when the time comes. Of course, we do lure coursing with our current pet greys and will do that as long as they are sound and enjoy doing it.
	__________________ Heather and the hounds Visit our pack at GreyhoundFreaks.com In loving memory of my Bridge Babies: Star, Annie, Casino, Erin ~ kitty Simon ~ fosters Dagger and DV

11-30-2006, 06:18 PM	#7 (permalink)
AgileOllie Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 70 Rep Power: 38	My opinion is this: In every dog sport there are dogs who are abused and taken for granted. I think that a dog who is bred to do a specific task should be excercised in that task, if they have a drive for it. Border collies should herd (or perform in agility, etc- whatever to keep their minds sharp) Dachshunds should go to ground, sight hounds should run. I don't know much about greyhound racing, so I can't say whether the CONDITIONS are cruel or not, but the acutal activity of running is what they were bred to do. Every sport - even conformation- can be cut-throat and there can be bad apples. My motto is- if my dog ain't having fun, then it's not worth it for either of us. Does that make sense? I have a tendency to ramble

11-30-2006, 10:04 PM	#8 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 281	I can only go by what I've heard from you KennelMom about it changing over the years and I do so hope that's the case. My own experiences with the tracks go back more years than I care to mention, my grandparents were huge fans and would drag me along often to watch the races. They actually owned several racers for a number of years. I remember seeing some very cruel things, dogs shot and dead dogs laying in piles at kennels away from the track just to name a few. I would like to be open minded enough to go back to a track and see for myself how they are now but don't think I could ever bring myself to do it. My past experiences from years ago left a very bitter taste and to this day I guess you could say I still hold a grudge. However, I am grateful to anyone who takes in retired racers and gives them a wonderful second chance at living the home life.
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~ Gerry Spence As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

11-30-2006, 10:50 PM	#9 (permalink)
*Rivsky* Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: South Australia Posts: 3,624 Blog Entries: 6 Rep Power: 132	I agree - if the dog loves it and the conditions in which it lives and races are good then there's no harm. I've never actually been to greyhound races before so I can't comment too much on it but I do believe the dogs get a real kick out of it. Like many others my one proviso on this is as long as once the dogs are retired they are allowed to lead happy, comfortable lives and are not put to sleep or neglected then I personally have no problem with the sport.

12-01-2006, 12:26 AM	#10 (permalink)
Novel Boxer Mom Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 4,854 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 214	I've never been to a greyhound track, although one still remains here in Wisconsin. I pass by the one in Iowa often on my way too and from shows. I've always wanted to stop, but dislike betting and gambling in any form, and so would not feel right even visiting the track. But as far as the actual sport. With the usual exceptions, I see nothing wrong with it. I find it exhilirating to watch horse races, and only imagine that dog races are very similar.

12-01-2006, 05:14 AM	#11 (permalink)
rottielover rottweiler true believer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: montreal, qc Posts: 656 Rep Power: 49	If you do it for fun with your friends yes, can be anything like agility or OB, but I totally disagree with the bigtime racing, where the poor things are stuffed in tiny cages, and are only used for making money the discareded once they are done
	__________________ Man should not fear a rottweiler, but a rottweiler has alot to fear of man. Loved by Harley ( M ) Oct, 1, 2004 And tigger july 2004 approx

12-01-2006, 06:30 AM	#13 (permalink)
rottielover rottweiler true believer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: montreal, qc Posts: 656 Rep Power: 49	I have seen many retired greyhounds, that have been adopted from big tracks. I have an issue as they are only there for racing. They do not have a home to call their own, until after their racing career. I have a problem with people making money off these poor creatures. Such as betting, not like prizes to be won.For the winner. Same goes for Conf shows. I understand some COE breeders also after they retire a bitch, prefer to place in a pet home due to they will have more time with love, and one on one basis. But to all honest with you I do not agree with that either. This is just my opinion. Everyone has there say. This is something I have read on GRa-america not my words During a greyhound's racing career he or she may stay at one track or be moved from track to track a few times to find a competitive niche. There are several grades of tracks around the country (a little like professional baseball -has major and minor leagues) and each track has numerous kennels. The details of the routine from one kennel to another may vary slightly but for the most part will be about the same as the example given above--not enough difference to be that noticeable by the dogs. This is what is alittle unsettling to me
	__________________ Man should not fear a rottweiler, but a rottweiler has alot to fear of man. Loved by Harley ( M ) Oct, 1, 2004 And tigger july 2004 approx Last edited by rottielover : 12-01-2006 at 06:40 AM.

12-01-2006, 06:30 AM	#14 (permalink)
Kuchi Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 379 Rep Power: 44	The sport of running is fine. But I don't like gambling on an animal. I'm okay with prizes to the winners, but for the crowd to bet I don't like. Its the same with horse racing I don't think betting should be involved and just prizes. I don't have a problem with people making money off their dog, but it should be given as 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place prizes. Money from the crowd is unnecessary to me. I still don't know enough about the races, if most are created equal, etc. As with the crates, thats not a problem with me as long as the animal can turn around in it. So with that I don't have an answer with the races themselves just no betting.

12-01-2006, 06:38 AM	#15 (permalink)
rottielover rottweiler true believer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: montreal, qc Posts: 656 Rep Power: 49	not saying it is a bad sport, as I said can be compared I guess to agility and OB, if the dog loves it, he/she loves it. I just do not agree with the lifestyle it leads on the track
	__________________ Man should not fear a rottweiler, but a rottweiler has alot to fear of man. Loved by Harley ( M ) Oct, 1, 2004 And tigger july 2004 approx

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