Please Help With Niki's Food

[greekblue]

If you have changed about three excellent brands and your dog does not like any, but she likes the junk food Proplan. What would you do -- keep wasting money on changing differend food? How long do you wait to be sure that your dog does not like the food, or is just simply that she will not eat it because it is mixed with her old food and she is used to the old one? Maybe, if I start putting all the new food in her bowl from now on, she will eventually to like it. How do you know for sure that your dog does not like one food?

Niki does not like Innova, although she would eat it when she only had Innova -- but not all the times. She would not even touch Eagle Pack, and at first I thought she liked Merrick because she never cared about the bag of food in her room, but she did about the Merrick kibble. Well, she even ate a few pieces as a treat and she came back for more. She would never touch any other kibble to eat it as a treat. Well, as soon as I put it with Proplan, so I can make the switch slowly, she started pushing the Merrick and try to eat, if possible, the Proplan only, or she would not eat.

I even separated a few pieces of each kibble on the floor, but next to each other; she smelled both and she went for the Proplan. She did the same with the Innova. Proplan is the food she was eating at her breeders. Also, she will not eat the adult Proplan; she only likes the large breed puppy version (that is what she was eating at her breeders).

I need to switch her to adult food anyway, so Merrick is great because is all life stages.

ALSO, WHEN SHOULD I START FEEDING HER TWICE INSTEAD OF THREE TIMES A DAY? AND HOW MUCH WATER DOES YOUR PUPPY DRING? NIKI DRINGS SOOOO MUCH WATER THAT SOMETIMES SHE SCARES ME; YET SHE IS HEALTHY AS FAR AS WE KNOW AT THIS POINT. SHE DRINGS A LOT, I MEAN A LOT OF WATER! Someone we met in a park, he saw her dringing water and he told me that the dog of his friend got sick from dringing too much water and I should not let her dring that much. She kept dringing probably for about a minute non-stop!

[Rivsky]

It's up to you whether you persist in getting her to eat a premium brand kibble or give into her and let her eat what she wants. I've heard that the cheaper kibble can be like the human equivalent of junk food (McDonalds, chocolate etc) for dogs so they actually become addicted to all the additives and crap in the food not the food itself.

You may have already done this but try and buy a bag of something that has the same base flavour as the Proplan she does eat (chicken or whatever it is) - may have something to do with it I'm not sure.

If Niki is only eating kibble and nothing else, she may be drinking too much because it can have a dehydrating effect on some dogs - the food is so dry they need to drink excess water to balance it up.

Being a large breed dog I'd be concerned about bloat if she is drinking so much - you may want to try adding canned food (which has a higher moisture content) or some mince or something to her diet to see if it makes a difference to how much she drinks. You could also limit her water and leave a bowl of ice cubes as she'll still have access to water but will take a little longer for her to actually consume it.

[greekblue]

Thank you for your input. I have not thought about ice cubes -- that is a great idea. Also, I did not realize that kibble might dehydrate the dog, and I did not know that too much water can cause bloating -- scary! She has a good to big size bowl and I have to fill it up with water more than four times a day -- sometimes more. She does get cottage cheese with her kibble the morning and with yogart the other two meals. I asked the vet about something similar to Proplan that she would like, and he said similar to Proplan is Iams -- another junk food according to my opinion. Also, Niki has a sensitive stomach and gets soft stools often. Sometimes, she will have firm stools and soft stools later, all the same day. It is frustrating. I do not want her to stay on Proplan. I want her to eat Merrick. Should I insist until she eats it? I think that if I take Proplan off site, she will eventually make it her food. I kind of make a joke out of it -- Niki likes junk food, just like her mommy Even in treats, she does not like the healthy ones, but she goes nuts over the junk. I was planning to add Merrick canned on her kibble, but I was waiting for her to be fully on Merrick before I added; I am just afraid that she might get the runs again. I think I am going to switch her fully to Merrick in a couple days and see what will happen. Hopefully, if she gets the runs, it will be over soon.

[calgal]

I feed strictly real food. It takes all the guess work out, it's much more healthy, you now exactly what they are eating and the love it.

[dogs4life]

Calgal - you were typing the same time as me...sorry. I just take longer to type with all my distractions, LOL. I just wanted to add, I agree "real food" is good for your dog too.

Looks like Rivsky gave you great advice but I wanted to add a few things.

My dogs like junk too, but they like fresh food better For treats you might want to use roasted chicken meat, it's a favorite in my house. It's simple and keeps great in the fridge, they will do anything for chicken...

About her poo, I'd pick one brand of food and stick with it. Her poo might be crazy because of the different brands and switching.

Chances are she is just not hungry if she does not eat, not really being picky. If she is hungry then she will eat. Do you know how much food your dog should be eating, do you think you are overfeeding? The recommendations on the bag are not accurate for my dogs. When I was feeding strictly kibble, my dogs ate much less than the chart on the bag and they were satisfied. I just had to trust them.

Maybe you can limit the feedings by only letting Niki eat for 10 minutes and then take the food away. If she finishes, great. If not, no biggy. If you limit the feedings to 10 minutes, you might want to offer food 3x a day to make sure she gets what she needs. I would just gauge it by how she acts and how fast she eats.

HTH

PS

I would also look into, if you have not already, how do prevent rapid growth in your dog. I know large breeds are prone to bone and joint problems when they grow too fast.

Also bloat prevention is great. I would rehydrate kibble before feeding (try not to use hot water, it will destroy some of the vitamins in the kibble) , limit exercise after eating and feed frequent small meals.

I more thing, most dogs I've lived with are competitive eaters. If they know someone else is interested in their food...like you are hovering over the bowl or another dog is sniffing around their food, then the dog is more likely to overeat.

[greekblue]

Do you think that if I stick with one brand for example maybe she will get the runs for a couple days and eventually she will used to the food and slowly her stomach will adjust?

Also, Calgal, what do you mean by saying real food? Do you mean people's food? Is not that supposed to be bad for the dogs? Can you give me an example of what you feed/cook for your dogs?

[TinyAlbinoDancer]

I think first you need to rule out a medical problem causing her excessive drinking. That does sound like an awful lot of water.

Then I would go with Rivsky's suggestion of finding a similar food of higher quality, and stick with it. When switching around for allergies, my vet said you have to have them on a food for a month before you'll see any difference, so I would aim to feed the same food for at least a month and then re-evaluate ("does she seem to like it? How is her overall health and condition? How much poop am I scooping?" Etc.).

[dogs4life]

I forgot to add, if you have full bags of dog food already opened and you don't plan on feeding them. You can either exchange the food for another brand or you can get your money back, many food companies have great return policies. It's worth looking into, I'd hate for you to waste money on food. Just call the store you bought the food from and ask about the policy and make sure to state your dog will not eat the food. I've returned my fair share of premium foods.

When I've switched kibble abruptly, my dogs get loose stools for 1-2 days, never more than 2 days. The stools were soft not runny, watery or mucousy.

I feed my dogs Innova Evo kibble and "real food". I feed roasted de-boned meats, raw meats with and without bones, raw veggies, raw fruit, yogurt, steamed rice, oatmeal and other foods.

Do you know exactly how much water your dog is drinking? Is your puppy peeing all the time too?

[greekblue]

No, she is not peeing all the time. She pees three times a day when I take her out (she holds it all night) and after she plays hard. She poops twice a day (sometimes three). When her stools are not hard, they are shaped, but soft (not runny or mucus, just soft). She has been to the vet consistently every three weeks since the second day I got her at 7 weeks old and she has all her vaccines (including Rabies completed). She also takes joint supplements for the past week and a half (Cosequin DS). She seems (also according to the vet) perfectly healthy, but maybe she has sensitive stomach and I need to go slow on changing foods or even treats. Even before I got her, the breeder had told me that she drings a lots of water. I go to work for 4 - 5 hours and she finishes her whole bowl (large). When I come back, I fill it up and she finishes the bowl in less than an hour -- I probably fill her bowl about five times a day.
Her energy is normal and she is alert, but she has more tears and more often in her eyes since I started Proplan again instead of the Innova I was giving her. Before, she barely had any tears (only the mornings); I would clean her eyes once a day -- after I started Proplan again, I have to clean her eyes several times a day. I do not know that the food is responsible for it (since she was getting that at her breeders), but I think with Innova her coat seemed clean for longer time and her eyes were clean -- I guess that might sound silly, but whatever the reason for that, it is true. I have an appointment tomorrow with her vet for ear cleaning and to check her teeth (some baby teeth seem to be stuck behind the new adult ones). I will ask about the water.
I have thought that maybe she does not eat much (like today she barely ate) because she gets too full of water.

Another thing is that the breed have almost all of the characteristics of all the breeds they were bred for -- one of them is Newfoundland. They love water as much as Newfoundlands do and they are also excellent swimmers. In a website of a seemingly ethical breeder, I read that Newfoundland puppies dring A LOT of water (more than other breeds). I do not know if that is true, but it might explain a little. Does anyone here have a Newfoundland or know about them?

SORRY FOR THE LONG POST!

[dogs4life]

The tears on Proplan tell me not to feed that diet. My dogs tear when they have allergies, especially food allergies. I would stop feeding Proplan.

I would worry more if Nicki pee'd more often, not to say she may not have a medical issue, but I'd expect her to pee more often if she had a kidney issue, water retention problem (most often potassium, calcium problems) or diabetes. Are you going to take her in for some testing?

[Sheltiemama]

My advise is simply pick the brand of kibble you wish her to eat and give her no choice as to whether she will eat it or not. No healthy dog will starve itself just because the food isn't what they want to eat.

I happen to home cook for my dogs and don't feed them kibble. As far as the water is concerned. She may be drinking out of habit rather than being thirsty. Put her water down every time you feed her and after she has played hard outside. Allow her to have the water bowl down for half hour then pick it up This will break the cycle of drink drink drink.

[greekblue]

I am taking her for a blood test, but I was thinking to take her to a different vet for some other opinion. The vet we see, he is through references and he is considered to be excellent! However, I want another opinion.