The Dogs Dinner: All You Wanted to Know About Food For Fido

[WingedFoal]

Woah, sorry about that, didn't mean to be a pest.... I was just wondering because it seemed your list differed from others I've seen. I thought maybe there was something you knew that I didn't know, because other than hearing about good foods and seeing there's no corn or byproducts in them, I don't know that much about the ingredients. I read your ingredients list and what was good and bad, but a lot of them weren't in my dog's food, and vice versa. So, once again, I'm sorry for asking.

[PhantomsPrinceWillia]

I honestly need to say Kaz and I started talking yesterday and Kaz opened my eyes to know what was in my dogs food. they love it but it isnt the best for them so I refuse to give my dog(s) anything less than perfect. They deserve because i take care and protect them now they will do the same for me later. I may get alot of lip from them now but they will feel better in the long run.

You all are right this isnt a debate. Kaz merely wants everyone to be able to look at this list and go out and buy the best food for their dogs. Instead of being like me going with science diet and paying 35 dollars for a bag of food that is not the best for my babies.

We eat the best. Dont our dogs deserve the same.

Kaz Hands Down to you. You done an awesome job and I appreciate it though my fiance is like yelling at me to stop changing the food around and just leave it at one. You are so complicated he says.

Well, My dobermans are the best and they deserve the best and they will get nothing less than that best!

Yay! Kaz, you done awesome.

[kazkirkpatrick]

Oh winged, you arent a pest! I really didnt mean it like that! Im not mean, I promise

My criteria were easy
Good: None of the forbidden ingredients and meat/meal as a first ingredient

Bad (which are still good, just not as good as the good!): Corn was allowable in these, but only further down the ingredients list, meat still had to be a first ingredient.

Ugly: The left overs. you should have seen some of these foods, I was mortified. Corn first ingredient, second as by product, third more corn then add some beef tallow with BHA. It was horrible! I think Im scarred for life!

[WingedFoal]

Oh, well that was easy (not the researching, though, I'm sure). I was thinking of it as an exact science or something . CSFTDLS has things like peas and carrots in it, and this thread suddenly got me worried that maybe, just maybe, these things weren't good for Bitty after all, even though she's done very well on it. I would switch her to something even better if I knew what it was. I don't want to settle for something that's only second-best.

I have to say, you did an awesome job listing everything. It got me interested completely and I went to the dog food comparison wizard that Natura has, and started comparing everything. I think I spent about an hour so far researching and comparing CS to others.

[kazkirkpatrick]

No exact science! Anyone can research dog food with ease, its just a matter of knowing whats good and whats bad. You dont need phD in doggy dinner to work it out!

[Kade]

I didn't see Merrick on your list, but according to the ingredients it seems like it makes the cut. Here they are in case you want to check it out and add it (this is the Dry food Puppy Plate ingredients list -- they also make a canned food that we have not tried):

Ingredients:
Turkey, Chicken Meal, Chicken, Oatmeal, Whole Barley, Duck, Whole Brown Rice, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols – a source of Vitamin E and Ascorbic Acid, a source of Vitamin C), Potatoes, Carrots, Peas, Natural Dried Chicken Liver, Whole Apples, Dicalcium Phosphate, Calcium Carbonate, Potassium Chloride, Lysine, Guar Gum, Salt, Choline Chloride, Zinc Amino Acid Complex, Whole Blueberries, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Whole Clove Garlic, Dried Chicken, Chicory Root, Marigold Extract, Lactobacillus Plantarum, Enterocococcus Faecium, Lactobacillus Casei, Lactobacillus Acidophilus, Natural Celery Flavor, Iron Amino Acid Complex, Vitamin E Supplement, Manganese Amino Acid Complex, Natural Color (tumeric), Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Copper Amino Acid Complex, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin D3, Niacin, Lecithin, Riboflavin Supplement, Biotin, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Cobalt Amino Acid Complex, Folic Acid, Thiamine Mononitrate, Sodium Selenite.

[Cassiepeia]

A good Australian dog food I've used is Nature's Gift.
All natural ingredients, no by-products or corn and no artificial colours or flavours and no preservatives. One other good thing about it is that you can find it at supermarkets down here.
I've only used their canned food (my dog has little to no teeth 'wet' food is the only option), but it seems great.

Cass.

[Sheltiemama]

All I want to say is thanks for taking your time and effort to help us find the best food for our dogs at the best possible price. You have obviously devoted a lot of time with your own research on this list and I think it's a good cross section of foods for us to consider.

Thank you again for your efforts

[GreenleafGreyhound]

Originally Posted by kazkirkpatrick

Thank You Cass! Thats why I didnt reply to the "where does my food go" questions! I spent two hours on the list so people could learn how to make decisions themselves, not to do it for them!

I also dont want to appear grumpy, I just want to educate!

Greenleaf, the Fromm ingredient list I have says
#1) Poultry by products
#2) ground corn
#3) Poultry by products meal

which looks pretty ugly to me! I didnt get it from the website, but a compilation of doggy food ingredients, so maybe thats where the problem lies! Your list does look good, mine looks darn ugly

Hmm, can you at least move Fromm up to The Bad? I checked out all their dry product ingredient lists and the worse formula has Ground Yellow Corn as the first ingredient, but no other 'bad' ingredients. Sorry I'm getting picky about it A very well respected grey owner I know feeds Fromm and she is quite knowledgeable about what to feed her pups. It just irks me to see Fromm along with Ol' Roy *Blech!*

Well, thought I'd throw in the first three ingredients to all the formulas (I already posted Adult Gold):

Senior Gold
Chicken
Chicken Meal
Duck

Puppy Gold
Chicken
Chicken Meal
Duck

Adult
Chicken
Ground Yellow Corn
Chicken Meal

Puppy
Chicken
Chicken Meal
Oat Flour

Performance
Chicken
Chicken Meal
Ground Yellow Corn

Lite
Chicken
Brewer's Rice
Ground Yellow Corn

Maintenance
Ground Yellow Corn
Chicken
Wheat Flour

Like I said, not the best, but not Ugly worthy

[Schwe]

Greenleaf, having corn as the first ingredient is terrible! I think that that would be the reasoning behind Kaz not having Fromm in a higher category.

Lets not forget that this list is, in its essence, subjective. Kaz has made this as a resource for people who are interested in learning more about kibble and its ingredients. It is not set in stone, not the kibble bible, and not something to get bent out of shape about. If you would like to feed your dog Pedigree, Ol'Roy, or the BEST of the best kibbles that is your choice. People can only express their opinions and preferences. If you believe that Fromm is good for your dog, then it is your choice to feed that kibble to your dog.

[GreenleafGreyhound]

I understand that it's a mere guideline, but I just don't think placing Fromm in The Ugly is correct DUE to the above guidelines. Like it was personally said from Kaz herself (ahhhh, you are a her, right...? ), The Bad foods can contain corn and other whatnot and many dogs can thrive on them. However, she stated that The Ugly foods are foods that no one should feed their dogs under any circumstance. That wording and the label of those foods give the assumption that Fromm's quality is similar to that of Pedigree and Ol' Roy (which are complete junk!), which it is not. Bumping Fromm up to The Bad would be appreciated, but I won't force it. It's your sticky, afterall

P.S. I feed EVO and have never fed Fromm

[rmci]

kazkirkpatrick,
Where did you find your information regarding all of the ingredients?

[Boleyn]

There are several formulas of Fromms... the Fromms Four-Star is their super-premium line, and is on the Whole Dog Journal's list. Here's the 4-Star Chicken a la Veg:

Ingredients:
Chicken, chicken meal, pearled barley, oatmeal, sweet potato, brown rice, white rice, whole dried egg, menhaden fish meal, millet, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), dried tomato pomace, canola oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols), oat hulls, herring meal, cheese, flaxseed, carrots, broccoli, cauliflower, apples, green beans, lecithin, potassium chloride, cranberries, blueberries, salt, monocalcium phosphate, chicory root extract, glucosamine hydrochloride, alfalfa sprouts, yucca schidigera, folic acid, whole clove garlic, parsley, chrondroiten sulfate, lactobacillus acidophilus, bifidobacterium longum, lactobacillus salivarius, enterococcous faecium, [vitamins, minerals, etc].

[Aussie_Dog]

Nature's Variety Prairie is in the top list, right (I didn't see it, but there's so many names there that I might have overlooked it). My dog is on California Natural, but I'm switching him to Prairie soon, just to see how he handles it. He's getting a little itchy on California Natural (because of the chicken formula, which I think he's allergic to), but if he doesn't do well on Prairie, I'm going to move him back to California Natural, but on the Lamb formula instead (I know he's not allergic to that).

And what are your thoughts on Nutro Ultra? Nutro MAX is bad, I know that, and Nutro Natural Choice is in between (I know corn is in there), but ULTRA is pretty underrated and is one of the better foods out there, or so I'm told. A lot of people don't realize that if they have a Petsmart, they can still feed their dog one of the better foods out there, even if they don't have a feed store that sells California Natural or Wellness or such foods like that. In my city, the best we have in our Petsmart and Petland (ugh) are Nutro Ultra and Natural Balance (we've got a feed store that sells the good stuff, but I didn't know that until a few months ago, right when my dog was doing horrible on a food [sensible choice] and was about to start Nutro Ultra)

[Sweetpea]

I talked to my vet today about a some of food from the good list. He said sure it might have better things in it. But the quality isn't always the best with smaller companies. Also that it's not tested as much as a big company. They have higher standards in testing the food. To keep the quality much higher and consistent. Also many breeders do use the food I use. He has also ran into dogs with problems from some of the foods on your good list. That have been very sick. All dogs are different it really depends on the breed and so many other factors. My parents had a dog for 14 years he ate just about anything. He was never sick. Which just amazed me. He ate people food and kibbles & bits. Which I know isn't very good. I would never think of giving it to Emma. But my parents dog had to be put down because of old age. He could no longer walk. It wasn't that he was sick form anything. His heart was strong. His body was just weak from old age. He ( Grimmy) was a great friend.
I think I'm going to keep Emma on the same food. She hasn't had any major problems. So why change a good thing. Your list did make me aware of things to watch for. I really have trust in my vet. I just hope I'm doing the right thing for Emma. Thank you for all your work on the list. I'm going to share it with my friends and family. To make them also aware of the good & the ugly. It's tuff wanting to be a good Mom to a cute cocker. I thinks it's important to speak to your vets before changing foods. If I had the money and time I think I would raise my own lambs and grow my own rice for Emma. I don't have a problem with paying more for better food. I just want Emma to be around for a long time. There are always good and bad points to people food too. Thanks again.