What would you do?

KatzDoggiez · 08-23-2005, 11:26 AM

Hello, first let me say a little about myself....I currently have two dogs both are golden retriever/chow mixes. Koda and Kaia. We have just recently (a week ago) been told that Kaia has been diagnosed with grade 3 luxating patellas in both of her back knees.
We are having problems with Kaia again. This poor dog is just riddled with problems. She was just recently diagnosed with a very rare genetic disorder called Pituitary Dwarfism. Basically her pituitary gland is not producing the right hormones to help her grow and thrive correctly but in doing so, it is creating more problems. She is about 6 months old physically but she has been since I have gotten her in February. We honestly have no idea how old she really is. She is definitely well over a year but she can be any age. Her teeth are not growing and her fur will not change and she will not get any bigger and she is mentally always going to be 6 months old. She is an EXTREMELY destructive chewer. She has shredded pop cans and hard plastic toys(literally into over 100 pieces), she has destroyed kongs and lately she has started eating my porch. The problem is, mentally she isn't learning not to do it. She will get it while I am outside with her and correct her but within just a short time she just forgets. That is unfortunately never going to change.

We are going to have a thyroid test done on her, if she does not have enough of the thyroid hormone she can develop pituitary tumors. She may have to be on thyroid meds for the rest of her life. That is where our big problem lies. She needs to have growth hormone to ever get her out of this state and that is not a guarentee just a possibility that it will help her. It is somewhere between $100-$300 a month for the rest of her life. There is absolutely no way I can afford that. We are putting off the $1500 knee surgery that she needs until we decide what to do. We do not want to put her to sleep but we cannot afford to fix her and I know that she will be in pain soon. More then she is now (due to her knees). I am waiting for a call back from our orthopedic surgeon to see what he thinks are our best solution. I am so frustrated. My hubby has kind of liked all of the pets we have had but he is not really a dog person but for some reason he has developed a very strong bond to Kaia and this is killing him. I don't know what to do.

What would you do if you were in my shoes?

(By the way, this is a very nice forum!)

621mum · 08-23-2005, 12:24 PM

Oh man! What a hard decision. How does this impact her life expectancy? I have heard that it is often a hereditary condition in dogs. Do you know if anyone in her "family" had it? I just don't know what I would do in your place. I will do a lot for my pets, but if you can't afford it then that is really hard.

shandoggy1 · 08-23-2005, 12:35 PM

I think I would reach deep down inside myself and think about what kind of quality of life this dog will have. (I'm afraid it sounds like not a very good one).
Unfortunately I would have to decide to humanely euthanize her due to the cost of everything she would need throughout the course of her life. I wouldn't be able to afford it either. It is a hard decision, but think about her and not yourself. Good luck

KatzDoggiez · 08-23-2005, 01:51 PM

From what I have read most dogs with this condition usually only live for around 2 years. There are exceptions of course but 2 is pretty much common. Kaia is minimum of 1 year already but probably older then that. We adopted Kaia from the local shelter in February so I have no idea if any of her littermates or previous generations had it. She was picked up as a stray. This is such a very hard decision for us. This is the second dog in three years that we have adopted with a congenital defect. We had to put our other girl down within two months (she was only 4 months old) she had a defect of her throat that made it so she couldn't swallow normally. We only had her for two months but we spent around $7000 and still had to have her put to sleep. We are afraid to spend alot of money again only to have her have to be pts or have her just die from this disease.
Thank you for your honest answers.

Charlie_boy · 08-23-2005, 01:55 PM

If she is on meds for the rest of her life i honestly dont think they care too much about that. I mean its not a massive intrusion on thier life. I had a dog who lived till 17 1/2 with cushings disease and she was on meds for the last 3 or 4 years of her life. We wher elucky though we could afford the $100 a month to buy what she needed. We went through something very similar to what are going through now in respect to the decisions on keeping her or the other alternative. I never for one moment regreted my choice in keeping her going on the meds. i would suggest having a word with you vet and see what they suggest for the best, if they say it will be fine for her to be on meds and you cant afford it then could you not give her to a another loving home that could afford her bills?
I hope it all works out for you and i can tell that you love both your dogs very much and sometimes that makes the choices harder for you.
Let us know how you get on with her

Sharona nd Charlie

KatzDoggiez · 08-23-2005, 02:52 PM

Well, I got a call back from my vet with devastating news. There is nothing we can do for Kaia. :cry: The thyroid medicine will not help her and neither will the other two medicines that were thought might help her. The growth hormone will only buy her time, not help her get any better. The vet feels she is probably a couple years old and dogs with this disorder typically only live for 2-4 years. He thinks that soon she will start having mental problems, he thinks her destructive behaviour is just the start. Plus she is going to start having more medical problems that will basically slowly kill her. He also said based on her x-rays of her knees that as soon as the cold hits (a month or so) she is going to get to the point where she cannot walk.

We are supposed to start watching her for signs that she is in pain or is getting worse. It is so hard knowing that Kaia is going to have to be put to sleep so soon. THIS IS WHY PEOPLE SHOULD GET THEIR MIXED BREEDS SPAYED AND NEUTERED! This is the second dog that I have had to put to sleep due to congenital birth defects. These are dogs(as much as I loved them) should NEVER had been born.

Crossfire Bulldogs · 08-23-2005, 02:59 PM

I'm so sorry to hear about your little girl.

I've been somewhat in your shoes; our boy Ty suffered from renal failure and only had a very short time to live ( was actually only given a few weeks to live ) and yet was still a very happy boy.

We decided we would do what we could for him as long as his quality of life was still good and although it was tough we managed somehow to come up with the $300.00 a month to continue his meds and care at home. Our big man managed to live a fairly normal and happy life for over a year and passed last month.

The most important thing for us was making sure Ty had "quality of life" and we had agreed that when it became too much for him, if he were in pain, suffering or unable to thrive in every other way other than getting his daily meds and IV that we would put him down. Ty took that decision out of our hands before it got to that point and I'm thankful for that. I miss my big guy every day but you know what, if I had to do it all over again I would and I don't regret the days I had left with him.

Only you can decide whats best and when Kaia's quality of life is no longer there. If there is honestly no way to allow her to stay with you financially until her time to go comes I hope that maybe your able to find someone who can make her last days as wonderful as possible.

Kade · 08-23-2005, 03:06 PM

What a tough situation; I'm so sorry about Kaia.

shandoggy1 · 08-23-2005, 05:25 PM

I am so sorry about your baby, You are a wonderful person to rescue these dogs. I am sorry with all the bad luck you have had. Usually the mixed breeds are the healthiest (so they say). I hope this won't deter you from adopting again. Don't give up.

southernmuse · 08-26-2005, 09:53 AM

I've been there as well- it's such a tough situation. We had a sheltie for several years who developed cancer in his lymph nodes- we started on the chemo treatments (not cheap, but we didn't want to lose him), but his quality of life deteriorated so much (side effects of the chemo just made him utterly heartbreakingly miserable) that we really felt it was worse for him to continue on the treatments and made the tough decision to put him down. I really feel for you!! I'm so sorry about Kaia.

KatzDoggiez · 08-26-2005, 11:25 AM

**UPDATE**
***UPDATE***

We made an appointment for Kaia to be put to sleep on September 8th. I went outside today to see her and Koda came running up to me but Kaia didn't. I walked over to her and she started to try to get up but then started whining and had to sit back down. After about 5 minutes she was able to stand again but now she will not run at all and she is kind of walking bow legged. She has been hurting today more then I have ever seen her. I am so sad at watching her struggle to try to even walk. Sometimes she is fine but when she is hurting, it is so very painful, you can see it in her eyes.

I love my baby girl but I cannot sit back and let her be in this kind of pain any longer. I know that some of you will disagree with this decision but I have no choice. I can't make her better and I cannot watch her in pain. Thank you all for the support you have given me and her since this all started happening. The degree that this has all declined in such a short time was so dramatic, I just hope that she can make it fairly happily until Sept. 8th. Thanks again.

Crossfire Bulldogs · 08-26-2005, 01:34 PM

I know how very hard this has been on you, your family and Kaia. I am sorry it has to come to this but it doesn't sound as if there is any other way.

**hugs to Kaia**

It takes a very special person to put their dog's welfare and needs in front of their own and I believe you have done that every step of the way. This is going to be one of the most difficult things you've ever had to do but always remember, your love for her will never be forgotten and what must come is only done because you do love her so very much.

Jude · 06-23-2007, 12:42 PM

I have two American Eskimo's diagnosed with Cushings. The vet hasn't mentioned meds just surgery. Can you tell me what meds you were/are using.
Thanks, Jude

LilacDragon · 06-23-2007, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jude

I have two American Eskimo's diagnosed with Cushings. The vet hasn't mentioned meds just surgery. Can you tell me what meds you were/are using.
Thanks, Jude

This thread is two years old, so I don't know if you are going to get a response from the OP.

You might try starting a new thread. And check Yahoo Groups. There are often groups for people who have dogs with long term issues and it seems to me that I have heard someone mention one about Cushings.

Giny · 06-23-2007, 04:28 PM

To Jude,
I wanted to mention that Cushings causes an increase of hormones called cortisones. The OP's dog had a decrease in hormones so it's a different situation.

My dog was just diagnosed with borderline Cushings. We have to bring him in for more test within 6 months of his last test to see if he's condition worsened. If so the vet wants to start him on meds called Lysodren. Do you know if he's diagnosed with pituitary gland tumors or is it adrenal gland tumors. I'm still learning on my dog's diagnosis but I've heard that meds work well on the cases with the pituitary tumors, which is about 85% of the cases, an less well with the adrenal gland ones. The latter condition works best with surgery.

08-23-2005, 11:26 AM	#1 (permalink)
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0	What would you do? Hello, first let me say a little about myself....I currently have two dogs both are golden retriever/chow mixes. Koda and Kaia. We have just recently (a week ago) been told that Kaia has been diagnosed with grade 3 luxating patellas in both of her back knees. We are having problems with Kaia again. This poor dog is just riddled with problems. She was just recently diagnosed with a very rare genetic disorder called Pituitary Dwarfism. Basically her pituitary gland is not producing the right hormones to help her grow and thrive correctly but in doing so, it is creating more problems. She is about 6 months old physically but she has been since I have gotten her in February. We honestly have no idea how old she really is. She is definitely well over a year but she can be any age. Her teeth are not growing and her fur will not change and she will not get any bigger and she is mentally always going to be 6 months old. She is an EXTREMELY destructive chewer. She has shredded pop cans and hard plastic toys(literally into over 100 pieces), she has destroyed kongs and lately she has started eating my porch. The problem is, mentally she isn't learning not to do it. She will get it while I am outside with her and correct her but within just a short time she just forgets. That is unfortunately never going to change. We are going to have a thyroid test done on her, if she does not have enough of the thyroid hormone she can develop pituitary tumors. She may have to be on thyroid meds for the rest of her life. That is where our big problem lies. She needs to have growth hormone to ever get her out of this state and that is not a guarentee just a possibility that it will help her. It is somewhere between $100-$300 a month for the rest of her life. There is absolutely no way I can afford that. We are putting off the $1500 knee surgery that she needs until we decide what to do. We do not want to put her to sleep but we cannot afford to fix her and I know that she will be in pain soon. More then she is now (due to her knees). I am waiting for a call back from our orthopedic surgeon to see what he thinks are our best solution. I am so frustrated. My hubby has kind of liked all of the pets we have had but he is not really a dog person but for some reason he has developed a very strong bond to Kaia and this is killing him. I don't know what to do. What would you do if you were in my shoes? (By the way, this is a very nice forum!)
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0

08-23-2005, 12:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
621mum in the House of Chaos Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 101 Rep Power: 59	Oh man! What a hard decision. How does this impact her life expectancy? I have heard that it is often a hereditary condition in dogs. Do you know if anyone in her "family" had it? I just don't know what I would do in your place. I will do a lot for my pets, but if you can't afford it then that is really hard.
	__________________

08-23-2005, 01:51 PM	#4 (permalink)
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0	From what I have read most dogs with this condition usually only live for around 2 years. There are exceptions of course but 2 is pretty much common. Kaia is minimum of 1 year already but probably older then that. We adopted Kaia from the local shelter in February so I have no idea if any of her littermates or previous generations had it. She was picked up as a stray. This is such a very hard decision for us. This is the second dog in three years that we have adopted with a congenital defect. We had to put our other girl down within two months (she was only 4 months old) she had a defect of her throat that made it so she couldn't swallow normally. We only had her for two months but we spent around $7000 and still had to have her put to sleep. We are afraid to spend alot of money again only to have her have to be pts or have her just die from this disease. Thank you for your honest answers.
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0

08-23-2005, 02:52 PM	#6 (permalink)
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0	Well, I got a call back from my vet with devastating news. There is nothing we can do for Kaia. :cry: The thyroid medicine will not help her and neither will the other two medicines that were thought might help her. The growth hormone will only buy her time, not help her get any better. The vet feels she is probably a couple years old and dogs with this disorder typically only live for 2-4 years. He thinks that soon she will start having mental problems, he thinks her destructive behaviour is just the start. Plus she is going to start having more medical problems that will basically slowly kill her. He also said based on her x-rays of her knees that as soon as the cold hits (a month or so) she is going to get to the point where she cannot walk. We are supposed to start watching her for signs that she is in pain or is getting worse. It is so hard knowing that Kaia is going to have to be put to sleep so soon. THIS IS WHY PEOPLE SHOULD GET THEIR MIXED BREEDS SPAYED AND NEUTERED! This is the second dog that I have had to put to sleep due to congenital birth defects. These are dogs(as much as I loved them) should NEVER had been born.
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0

08-23-2005, 02:59 PM	#7 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 281	I'm so sorry to hear about your little girl. I've been somewhat in your shoes; our boy Ty suffered from renal failure and only had a very short time to live ( was actually only given a few weeks to live ) and yet was still a very happy boy. We decided we would do what we could for him as long as his quality of life was still good and although it was tough we managed somehow to come up with the $300.00 a month to continue his meds and care at home. Our big man managed to live a fairly normal and happy life for over a year and passed last month. The most important thing for us was making sure Ty had "quality of life" and we had agreed that when it became too much for him, if he were in pain, suffering or unable to thrive in every other way other than getting his daily meds and IV that we would put him down. Ty took that decision out of our hands before it got to that point and I'm thankful for that. I miss my big guy every day but you know what, if I had to do it all over again I would and I don't regret the days I had left with him. Only you can decide whats best and when Kaia's quality of life is no longer there. If there is honestly no way to allow her to stay with you financially until her time to go comes I hope that maybe your able to find someone who can make her last days as wonderful as possible.
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~ Gerry Spence As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

08-23-2005, 12:35 PM	#3 (permalink)
shandoggy1 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 1,209 Rep Power: 93	I think I would reach deep down inside myself and think about what kind of quality of life this dog will have. (I'm afraid it sounds like not a very good one). Unfortunately I would have to decide to humanely euthanize her due to the cost of everything she would need throughout the course of her life. I wouldn't be able to afford it either. It is a hard decision, but think about her and not yourself. Good luck

08-23-2005, 01:55 PM	#5 (permalink)
Charlie_boy shally Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Liverpool UK Posts: 146 Rep Power: 62	If she is on meds for the rest of her life i honestly dont think they care too much about that. I mean its not a massive intrusion on thier life. I had a dog who lived till 17 1/2 with cushings disease and she was on meds for the last 3 or 4 years of her life. We wher elucky though we could afford the $100 a month to buy what she needed. We went through something very similar to what are going through now in respect to the decisions on keeping her or the other alternative. I never for one moment regreted my choice in keeping her going on the meds. i would suggest having a word with you vet and see what they suggest for the best, if they say it will be fine for her to be on meds and you cant afford it then could you not give her to a another loving home that could afford her bills? I hope it all works out for you and i can tell that you love both your dogs very much and sometimes that makes the choices harder for you. Let us know how you get on with her Sharona nd Charlie

08-23-2005, 03:06 PM	#8 (permalink)
Kade 9 months old?! Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 903 Rep Power: 85	What a tough situation; I'm so sorry about Kaia.
	__________________ "You come home, the dog throws itself at you. 'Where have you been? You've been so long. I missed you, missed you, missed you. I love you, love you, love you. What's in the bag? Something for me? Oh, let me lick your ear. Oh, let me chew your gloves. You're home!''' -- Pam Brown All About Winston

08-23-2005, 05:25 PM	#9 (permalink)
shandoggy1 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 1,209 Rep Power: 93	I am so sorry about your baby, You are a wonderful person to rescue these dogs. I am sorry with all the bad luck you have had. Usually the mixed breeds are the healthiest (so they say). I hope this won't deter you from adopting again. Don't give up.

08-26-2005, 09:53 AM	#10 (permalink)
southernmuse Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Levittown, PA Posts: 8 Rep Power: 0	I've been there as well- it's such a tough situation. We had a sheltie for several years who developed cancer in his lymph nodes- we started on the chemo treatments (not cheap, but we didn't want to lose him), but his quality of life deteriorated so much (side effects of the chemo just made him utterly heartbreakingly miserable) that we really felt it was worse for him to continue on the treatments and made the tough decision to put him down. I really feel for you!! I'm so sorry about Kaia.

08-26-2005, 11:25 AM	#11 (permalink)
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0	UPDATE *UPDATE* We made an appointment for Kaia to be put to sleep on September 8th. I went outside today to see her and Koda came running up to me but Kaia didn't. I walked over to her and she started to try to get up but then started whining and had to sit back down. After about 5 minutes she was able to stand again but now she will not run at all and she is kind of walking bow legged. She has been hurting today more then I have ever seen her. I am so sad at watching her struggle to try to even walk. Sometimes she is fine but when she is hurting, it is so very painful, you can see it in her eyes. I love my baby girl but I cannot sit back and let her be in this kind of pain any longer. I know that some of you will disagree with this decision but I have no choice. I can't make her better and I cannot watch her in pain. Thank you all for the support you have given me and her since this all started happening. The degree that this has all declined in such a short time was so dramatic, I just hope that she can make it fairly happily until Sept. 8th. Thanks again.
KatzDoggiez Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0

08-26-2005, 01:34 PM	#12 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 281	I know how very hard this has been on you, your family and Kaia. I am sorry it has to come to this but it doesn't sound as if there is any other way. hugs to Kaia It takes a very special person to put their dog's welfare and needs in front of their own and I believe you have done that every step of the way. This is going to be one of the most difficult things you've ever had to do but always remember, your love for her will never be forgotten and what must come is only done because you do love her so very much.
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~ Gerry Spence As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

06-23-2007, 12:42 PM	#13 (permalink)
Jude Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0	I have two American Eskimo's diagnosed with Cushings. The vet hasn't mentioned meds just surgery. Can you tell me what meds you were/are using. Thanks, Jude
Jude Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 7 Rep Power: 0

06-23-2007, 04:28 PM	#15 (permalink)
Giny poodlez Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,010 Rep Power: 104	To Jude, I wanted to mention that Cushings causes an increase of hormones called cortisones. The OP's dog had a decrease in hormones so it's a different situation. My dog was just diagnosed with borderline Cushings. We have to bring him in for more test within 6 months of his last test to see if he's condition worsened. If so the vet wants to start him on meds called Lysodren. Do you know if he's diagnosed with pituitary gland tumors or is it adrenal gland tumors. I'm still learning on my dog's diagnosis but I've heard that meds work well on the cases with the pituitary tumors, which is about 85% of the cases, an less well with the adrenal gland ones. The latter condition works best with surgery.
	__________________ Poodle Rescue of New England

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