A hard lesson and some food for thought...

[ewarp]

This is a long drawn out story, but I'll make it as short as possible.
In early January, I took in yet another foster. He was a young adult male cattle dog. He was intact, and had lived in a garage for the majority of his life. He was reactive, under-socialized, a resource-guarder, and aggressive to other males. No one could touch his collar, restraining him was impossible.

We slowly started working through the issues. I installed obedience commands, desensitized him to having his collar touched, neutered him, and started taking him out to socialize. I got bit trying to keep him and a loose (male) dog away from each other. It wasn't a serious bite, he was worked up about the other dog. I made excuses for him. I had blood panels and workups run- to use FancyChicken's words, he's just a jerk.

We kept working. He was no longer resource guarding. I could take anything away, as could my fiance and my best friend. When my dogs would steal his rawhide, he'd redirect his aggression onto the sofa or a wicker basket or the stairs or his bed or else start spinning. 90% of the time he was fine about having his collar grabbed. My vet and I were discussing behaviorists and drugs, but hadn't come to any concrete conclusions.

A few nights ago, I was sitting on the couch reading. Joe was playing PS2, sitting on the floor. The dogs were in their respective spots- Saboo in her chair, Hippo on her bed, Stanley on his bed. Hippo came over and sniffed at Stan's rawhide- she didn't touch it that we saw, and Stan redirected his aggression onto Joe.

Joe ended up with a large but fairly shallow (but bloody!) wound and a ton of bruising over his entire chest. His mom is a nurse and was appalled, but assured us that it was not in need of stitches.

I had Stan euthanized. It's not simply because he bit me, or bit Joe. He was unpredictable. He was aggressive. I'm learning more and more, that a dog that exhibits aggression cannot be trained out of it. He was food aggressive, he was aggressive about toys, he was aggressive about "his" bed, he was aggressive about being handled, he was aggressive towards other dogs.

I took him on, knowing most of this, and hoping I could turn him around. I got many of his behaviors under control in my home, but he was a temporary resident. As soon as he changed environments, he'd be back at square one.

Additionally, in the time that I spent with him, I received multiple inquiries about taking in other dogs- dogs that were well-behaved, but out of time. Dogs that I could have placed quickly and easily. There are so many animals being euthanized out there... The time I spent with Stan, attempting to fix him could have resulted in me pulling and placing 3-4 dogs that ended up euthanized instead.

My mind is going a mile a minute, and I don't regret taking Stan on- he was a learning experience. I feeling as though aggression is a behavior that can only be managed, not eliminated. Is a dog that displays aggression, simply that- an aggressive dog?

[britishbandit]

Awww, what a shame about Stan. It breaks my heart that it wasn't his fault he was this way, he just never had the right start to life. And kudos for you for taking him in despite his problems, but you did what you could, both you and Joe suffered bites until the decision to have him put down was made.

I think aggression issues vary from dog to dog, and the severity of it will be a key factor in whether or not the dog is able to be rehabilitated. I wouldn't say all dogs that show aggression are lost and unable to be turned around. But I think after so long of being neglected and forced to be that way, there is a point of no return, no matter how hard you work to try and fix the problems.

I think it's quite possible, that Stan just may have needed to be the single dog/pet in the home to get past this. After being forced to endure the most part of his life contained in a garage, he needed the full focus of his owner/s (if he was going to make a turn around), without the distractions of other pets. I do believe that some dogs just cannot be around other pets after spending so long in solitary confinement and not being accustomed to it. Non-socialized and not having the learning experience of doggy behavior and being part of another animal pack. It sounds like the issues were improving, and it was indirectly other dogs that caused the bites on both you and Joe.

[rottielover]

you made a hard decision, but I believe a correct one. I do not believe unpredictable negative behaviour can be helped. That is what it is. Unpredictable. Some dogs are wired wrong. I do not know his past . Nor do you, so he could have had a very rough start to it. You did more for this dog than anyone else. You tried.
Some times hardest choice is the best choice.
I too had to PTS a dog that had more demons than you could imagine. My heart is with you

[trainingrixie]

Sorry I can't help you with your question on aggressiveness...Shelby (the dog I babysit) and Trixie are very wimpy! But I am soooo sorry to here about what you've been through. As much as it sucks to have to have a dog put down, your family's well being MUST take precidence (sp?) over any animal. That's my feelings anyway...so I feel you made the right decision.

[KennelMom]

You made a very tough decision...but ultimately one that I think was the right one. Don't dwell to much on the shoulda, woulda, couldas of the past. Stan came to you for a reason...he taught you some things and that will prepare you better for helping dogs in the future.

Sending hugs...losing a dog, foster or otherwise, is never easy {{{{}}}}

[AgileOllie]

I know first hand about what you are talking about. We, as rescuers, deal with this all the time, and I think that in most cases, we understand each other better than anyone else could. I feel for you and the decision you had to make, but I do believe it was the right one. You are absolutley correct- you an get a dog to act a certain way in YOUR home, but adopting him/her out is a crap shoot. A dog like that needs a very specific home. In most cases, the best home for a dog like that is YOUR home. That's almost never feasible, though, because of what you said- as long as you foster this unadoptable dog, ADOPTABLE dogs are being euthanized. You also have to worry about liablility. Where do you draw the line?
I think you did the right thing. Hugs to you.

[Doglover1988]

Aww i'm sorry about that! You tried your best and I agree you made the right choice. I wish more people in the world cared about dogs as much as you do.

[IceyBlueSibes]

I'm very sorry things had to escalate to that point, but you did what you could for him. You made the right choice. It definetly would have been hard to find the right home for him.

[ewarp]

Originally Posted by britishbandit

I think aggression issues vary from dog to dog, and the severity of it will be a key factor in whether or not the dog is able to be rehabilitated. I wouldn't say all dogs that show aggression are lost and unable to be turned around. But I think after so long of being neglected and forced to be that way, there is a point of no return, no matter how hard you work to try and fix the problems.

I think it's quite possible, that Stan just may have needed to be the single dog/pet in the home to get past this. After being forced to endure the most part of his life contained in a garage, he needed the full focus of his owner/s (if he was going to make a turn around), without the distractions of other pets. I do believe that some dogs just cannot be around other pets after spending so long in solitary confinement and not being accustomed to it. Non-socialized and not having the learning experience of doggy behavior and being part of another animal pack. It sounds like the issues were improving, and it was indirectly other dogs that caused the bites on both you and Joe.

And that's just it- I think a lot of aggression can be managed. Food aggression is an easy one to manage. Saboo is aggressive towards other alpha bitches. I can manage that without too much of an issue, and she's become desensitized to a degree. Aggression doesn't mean it's a bad dog, but I don't think aggression can ever be fully "put to bed," to the point that is no longer of concern. I can allow Saboo around female dogs, but I certainly stay close and am prepared to step in.

That said, I really believe that there is no such thing as an accidental bite, or a dog almost biting. If a dog wants to bite, they will. Their teeth clicking a half inch away from your skin? Intentional. They are very aware of where their teeth are and what they are doing with them. For a dog to put it's teeth on a human and draw blood, not once, but twice within thirty seconds? IMO, that's a dog that will not hesitate to bite a human again in the future. I don't care that it was redirection.

Ever since the last trip to the vet with Stanley, I've been rehashing this situation over and over. I feel terrible, I've cried so much, but I know I did the right thing. This has been a heck of a learning experience.

[sammy]

I can sure empathise. I was in a situation very similar a -cattle dog cross kept in a garage for his first 18 months with big issues. Boy did I learn some big lessons from that dog.

It's unfortunate when dogs get to the point that there is very little left that we can do to make them OK, safe and adoptable.

Some dogs can recover from the most unthinkable horrors imagineable and some can't. I think genetics plays a role.

We'd like to believe that love, training, neutering and finding the right home can make a good outcome for every single dog, but sometimes it can't.

There are precious few people even willing to foster a dog in a situation like that, far fewer that want to adopt and that have the knowledge and skills to do what that dogs needs and safely manage him. Good for you for being willing to try.

I think it's an important point too about healthy adoptable animals being euthanised in the meantime due to lack of space while one dog with huge problems occupies a foster home. I think that's the most difficult issue rescue groups and humane societies face.

Run free at the bridge Stanley. No doubt you're in a happier place.

[britishbandit]

I'm not saying you did the wrong thing by taking him in, I really admire your effort to even try. I can understand it being a very hard decision as well.

I also believe that in situations like his, things could potentially work out if he/she was the only pet in the home, and with someone who has the time and patience to work with them. It's a very hard find though, as people who have the knowledge like yourself to work with the dog, always have other pets. If the dog had bitten just to bite, different story, red zone dogs aren't fixable, but the bites in Stan's case were a result from redirection from another animal. Again, finding a home that has everything he needed would've been extrememly difficult. And you did make the right choice. I do think that these dogs deserve as much of a chance as the ones who are adoptable, but it's hard to think that by trying to save an aggressive one, more dogs that could be placed are being euthanized.

Seems like a no win situation.

[Rivsky]

I'm so sorry you had to go through all of that but I think despite the aggression Stanley would still have been grateful to you in someway for trying to get his issues under control when many would have just walked away.

[ewarp]

Originally Posted by Rivsky

I'm so sorry you had to go through all of that but I think despite the aggression Stanley would still have been grateful to you in someway for trying to get his issues under control when many would have just walked away.

Thanks. I keep trying to think positively-

I gave him a warm bed, snuggles, walks, petting, attention and treats- more of all of that than he'd had in his entire life. He left this world in my arms, with apologies being whispered in his ear. I'm tearing up just thinking about putting him down.

Thank you everyone for being so supportive. This has been so hard.

[TinyAlbinoDancer]

((hugs)) You did absolutely everything you could Ellen. Don't be ashamed for having taken him in just because he wasn't able to become a good pet. You gave him a chance, and that's what matters. I would've been angry had you actually placed him in a home because that's not fair to other dogs or humans. It may of been Stan's genetics that coupled with the environment made him unable to function in society, but regardless he just couldn't. You did the right thing for everyone. Think on everything you did do and how much progress you WERE able to make rather than what Stan wasn't able to become. More

[Cassiepeia]

Ellen I'm so sorry to hear about Stan. You did a great thing for him, even though it didn't work out. His life with you was heaven compared to what he came from. That is the best gift you could have given him.

Cass.