WHY ? kind of a Rant

PawNclaws · 07-24-2007, 09:04 AM

Now this may seem all mixed, possibly not making to much sense.. So forgive me....

Anyhoo, I've seen it on allot of websites about breeding. I've seen it on GP and I've been told by 2 Lab breeders - DON'T breed your dog, if he/she was not produced by a Ch.(sire or dam) or comes from a pedigree w/4 or more "titled dogs". Now I am aware that I may get jumped on for this, but I think I have got to express this.

I've noticed quite a few Labs, especially imports but also Labs bred in the states,in a few breeding programs, have few "Titles" behind them- some NOT all have 2, 3 or even 5. Yet they are owned by respectable breeders, so no-one makes a fuss. If they had been owned by, lets say a novice and no-one knew who bred them, the owner(I) would get the "get him/her fixed" speech from a few Lab breeders b/c the pedigree isn't good enough. I know, I've been bashed b/c of me wanting to show Beau. 2 "Breeders" say "he's unlikely to be show quality" b/c of his pedigree- these breeders I have NOT met nor have then ever seen a good picture of nor have the personally seen Beau. Did I get angry - you betcha ! I was NOT aware that the 3rd Gen. doesn't count. What about the 2nd ? who cares, he wasn't produced by a Ch. right ! Well quite frankly I'm sick and tired of getting slapped in the face and put down by a few snobs who think only good dogs come from Champions and Ch. filled pedigrees. Well, they are dead wrong and it will be a cold day in He!! when I start listening to them !

NOW I am NOT saying all breeders are like this. I don't want to single out the two breeders above, it would be wrong. Just know that I am only talking about the breeders who put me down.

Conclusion : Unless your a seasoned breeder, it's NOT ok to breed a dog that did not come from a Ch. ; 3 Gen. is "to far back" - " they don't count" ... even if your dog meets the requirements in breeding, if the dog wasn't bred out of Ch.s it's not good enough !

Even though I'm unsure of Beau's breeding future(I've not really thought about it) ... he has a pedigree that matches up to many labs in a few other programs - I have a mentor(2 actually) - and Beau will be Health Screed for Hips, Elbows , Eye's and Heart .... But WHY still, did I get put down for wanting to show him ; for me wanting to *try* to gain a few titles in the future; to gain experience handling with the "big dogs" ; to HAVE FUN !.. WHY did these 2 feel they needed to crush my hopes and dream of Showing Beau. WHY ??

Maybe it's me, maybe they just don't think *I'm* good enought to be in "their world".... What is it they don't like ? is it my views , that I think breeding 2 to 3 litters every year is to many ?, that breeding a litter, only to place all of them on limited Reg. is wrong ? believing that a conformationally and mentally sound dog, CAN come from a not-so-Ch. filled- pedigree ? possibly because I DO answer peoples questions, and I DO pay attention to ALL of them ? because I don't think a CH. means a whole H.E. Double-hocky-sticks of allot if the dog isn't proven else where ? maybe because I'm YOUNG and, they think stupid ?

Who knows ! I just know what they said that day, was wrong and out of line ..

SpringerLover · 07-24-2007, 09:32 AM

Well, theoretically, they're correct. Did he come from health tested lines? Did he come from a responsible breeder? Do you KNOW his background in and out?

When the breeders didn't breed with cation, it IS irresponsible to breed the offspring, no matter HOW great the dog is.

It's a shaky line, but one I stick to the safe side of. There are way too many unknowns when breeding a dog that you don't know the absolute in and outs of in a pedigree. One that you can't ask for unbiased opinions of the sire/dam and further back.

I would never breed a dog from an irresponsible breeder, like I said, no matter HOW 'good' the dog is.

LilacDragon · 07-24-2007, 09:36 AM

First off - let me start by saying that Labradors (in all of their glorious colors) are the most popular dog registered with AKC. Some 10,000 more labrador puppies are registered yearly then the second most popular breed (which slips my mind at this moment). RIGHT NOW, there are 26,280 labradors listed on Petfinder. As you may or may not know, Petfinder lists somewhere between 50% and 75% of the homeless dog in the U.S.

IMHO - making sure that your dog meets the standard is a VERY important step in the breeding process. Therefore, your puppy should come from Championship parents. Does this mean you shouldn't show him - heck no! Go ahead! Pay the fees and soak up the experience. But remember - getting a championship is expensive and time consuming.

You have a male dog, don't you? While you may well show him to his championship - please remember that the owner of the bitch will be looking at the whole package. Not just his Championship but his pedigree. What his lines have produced is VERY important. While your dog may have his title and all of his health clearances, what about his siblings, his parents and their siblings, their parents and their siblings?

When I go looking at a breeder to get a puppy from - the first thing I will be looking at is titles and health clearances on the parents. Then I will be looking at lines. And if there is a dog or two in the pedigree that don't have a championship - then I will expect the breeder to be able to tell me why that particular dog was used. IE. - this dog was beautiful specimen of the breed but the owner was concentrating more on schutzhund or French ring training. The dog was used for breeding to add drive to the lines.

Sorry, but there are soooooo many labs out there and soooo many are put to sleep every single year that I don't think that just having a championship is a good reason to breed.

PawNclaws · 07-24-2007, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Well, theoretically, they're correct. Did he come from health tested lines? Did he come from a responsible breeder? Do you KNOW his background in and out?

Yes, I do actually... His sire and Dam were both Health Tested(Hips, Elbows, Eye's) but this isn'y about that, it's about me Showing Beau !

Quote:

First off - let me start by saying that Labradors (in all of their glorious colors) are the most popular dog registered with AKC. Some 10,000 more labrador puppies are registered yearly then the second most popular breed (which slips my mind at this moment). RIGHT NOW, there are 26,280 labradors listed on Petfinder. As you may or may not know, Petfinder lists somewhere between 50% and 75% of the homeless dog in the U.S.

I am aware of how many Labs are homeless, and I am aware they are popular and I am aware of how many are reg. But what does that have to do with me Showing Beau ? Again, I am NOT talking about me breeding him....Please don't turn thing into a breeding battle. I just wanted to express hwo hurtful it is, to have people tell you your dog isn't good enough to be shown, based on his pedigree...

Quote:

IMHO - making sure that your dog meets the standard is a VERY important step in the breeding process. Therefore, your puppy should come from Championship parents. Does this mean you shouldn't show him - heck no! Go ahead! Pay the fees and soak up the experience. But remember - getting a championship is expensive and time consuming.

Obviously you have not read any post of mine, expressing how much STANDARD means to me when Labs are bred. It's sad to see Labs bred, with no regards to the standard and I am sad to say, that I see this happening to often.. I am fully aware of all the costs and I know it's very hard, especially in labs, to gain a Ch. title. But again, I am not talking about breeding , so please don't turn this into a breeding debate.

Quote:

You have a male dog, don't you? While you may well show him to his championship - please remember that the owner of the bitch will be looking at the whole package. Not just his Championship but his pedigree. What his lines have produced is VERY important. While your dog may have his title and all of his health clearances, what about his siblings, his parents and their siblings, their parents and their siblings?

I NEVER said any thing about breeding him....Only Showing him... I said I was unsure of his breeding future....as I am. I'm relying on the judge to decide and of course, his health clearances.. Even then I may still just show him and then neuter him. Studding a dog out is not easy, I know that. But again, I'm NOT talking about, nor have I stated I plan to breed him. This is exactly WHY I did a rant. Because the other 2 breeders "assumed" the same darn thing.

I knew what to expect on some level, but I thought I'd get a little support. Not people telling me not to breed- I though some of you knew me better then that on here

. I may be young, but d*mn it, I'm not stupid !

LilacDragon · 07-24-2007, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Does this mean you shouldn't show him - heck no! Go ahead! Pay the fees and soak up the experience. But remember - getting a championship is expensive and time consuming.

If you want to show him - go for it!!

Please remember that, while you brought this up, this is a very public forum and more often then not - guests outnumber members reading posts. I am sorry that you are not thrilled with what I had to say, but if it stops just one guest from breeding their dog, then it was well worth it.

aquarian215 · 07-24-2007, 10:36 AM

Who cares what others say, if you want to show your dog, do it, and good luck, some people just like to give opinions when they are not asked for one, don't let it get to you, smile and nod, and then do whatever you feel is best.

CdnRottieMom · 07-24-2007, 11:02 AM

Just read your post and I never got the idea that you wanted to breed Beau, but I can see how some of the others may have been mistaken. Majority of people who show their dogs, do so to eventually breed them. If you want to show Beau and get him health tested, then I say go ahead and do it. It is costly though, the expenses of dog shows and training (agility, dog sports, etc...) do add up. In the end it will be fun for both you and Beau, and you'll have that experience behind you.

trainingrixie · 07-24-2007, 12:08 PM

i say...screw those 2 breeders and anyone else who wants to hold you and beau back from showing. go for it!!

IceyBlueSibes · 07-24-2007, 12:57 PM

I'm with Cdn mom on this one -- I never interpreted the fact that you wanted to breed him directly after showing. I know you're better than that

I've known for a long time about you talking about what you and your mom would like to do in the future. I think showing Beau is YOUR choice. The breeders have no right to tell you not to show him, even if his pedigree is not worthy. Breeding is a completely different story, which is something you didn't mention doing, and only the fact you want to show him. I think it would be a good start to learn how to handle a dog in the ring.

So, I say go for it if you want to! I don't see anything wrong with it, because what else is going to happen? If you show Beau, and he's not a good specimen -- well then that's something you'd find out, wouldn't it

If you did achieve a title to his name, that's when I would look at his pedigree.

Isn't it true though that some breeders dislike others?

borzoimom · 07-24-2007, 02:22 PM

The problem lies in the 26,000 something that need homes in a already popular breed.. Lets compare here- Borzois had like 695 registered last year to how many 10 grand + of Labs?
Showing is to determine breeding stock- thats the whole purpse of it. And while you can excellent lines but the dogs are not titled themselves for whatever reasons, with the massive amount of a breed in shelters across the US, instead of more pups- adopt what is already out there..

IceyBlueSibes · 07-24-2007, 04:14 PM

That may be the intended purpose of confirmation, but there are many out there who still do it just for fun. I was actually interested in enrolling Sheiba in shows, via the "breeders" were willing to change her registration, but she had already been spayed, so I was unable to do so. I would have never done it for breeding -- just for fun.

Paws - I would just ignore the comments about breeding, as this is not what you were mentioned you were going to do. Many are assuming you're going to if you show Beau. As I said in my first post, I'd go ahead and show him no matter what others say. If you have the time and money to do so, I see nothing wrong with it.

Crossfire Bulldogs · 07-24-2007, 06:13 PM

I guess I'm not exactly sure how this turned into a breeding issue right off the bat or how the amount of labs available currently on pet finder has anything to do with you wanting to show your boy but, like has already been mentioned - I guess I can see where someone might assume.

After all, conformation showing is about the evaluation of breeding stock and yes there may be a possibility of your boy not only doing well in the ring but one day possibly being used for breeding purposes but - that isn't the issue at hand right now.

There are breeders out there that would not only prefer but refuse to breed anything that doesn't have a title in front of it first however, in my opinion not always does the title make the brood bitch or sire and I can list many champions who came from an untitled sire, dam or both!

Bottom line in my opinion, if your boy meets the standard and you want to show him then it doesn't matter how far back in his pedigree a title is or isn't.....what matters is your boy, in the show ring, being judged against a set standard and thats that. Politics can be a very cruel and unforgiving master and not one that I would venture to tie myself to.

PawNclaws · 07-24-2007, 06:51 PM

Oh I'm still going to show him- nothing they can say can stop me. I just had to get that out there. I just find it wrong that they actually tried stopping me from showing. I thought they wanted people out there doing fun things with their dogs ? For me, it happends to be shows. What if they did/ do this to some one very much new, with their first Lab- it's sad to even think about how hurt they would be. I just don't agree with people putting others down like that... It really put an impression on me that not all breeders welcome new comers into the show world easily.. I wasn't really expecting to get bashed...for wanting to show

Crossfire,. I expect the worst, but I really want to show, so I'm prepared.. He's my only boy and he will be the last male I even get- it's been an experiance and I can't imagine how the next 16 years are going to be- fun I know !.. I love him dearly and I want to share the excitment with him that the show ring offers. If he never places, it's not the end of the world or if he doesn't enjoy him self, well he'll be neutered and we'll see about other sports. I want handling skills and I want to enjoy my fav. sport with Beau and, later, Bella..... Well I've had him looked over. He's OK , but he's growing so things can still pop up.. A few flaws are his feet and he's a bit high in the rear, not by much but you can see it . I've not really had any one go over him recently though , but I don't plan to until his first show. I want to see what a judge thinks of him. I already know he's gorgeous

but all dogs are gorgeous in their owners eye's ..

Crossfire Bulldogs · 07-25-2007, 07:38 AM

I think it's terrible when someone, anyone, in any breed attempts to discourage a person from wanting to learn and show. Those that do not only fail to realize that someone has to "take over" the breed after their gone but that in pushing new people away their hurting the breeds future.

As the old saying goes, want something done right then do it yourself. Those that whine and moan over new folks coming into the ring should be taking the time to teach them how it's done. Leave a legacy for your breed not a hindurance.

It's sad but there are more breeds out there like that, with people who want nothing to do with new folks and some try very hard to push everyone away that isn't in their "clique". I remember when I first started in Bulldogs, it took over a year before most would even make eye contact with us let alone say hello. Since then I make sure that new people are approached and welcomed by our kennel because I remember how it felt to be the outsider.

We were determined that no one was going to stop us from showing and I applaud you for wanting to do the same. Stick to it and go for it!

IceyBlueSibes · 07-25-2007, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crossfire Bulldogs

I think it's terrible when someone, anyone, in any breed attempts to discourage a person from wanting to learn and show. Those that do not only fail to realize that someone has to "take over" the breed after their gone but that in pushing new people away their hurting the breeds future.

As the old saying goes, want something done right then do it yourself. Those that whine and moan over new folks coming into the ring should be taking the time to teach them how it's done. Leave a legacy for your breed not a hindurance.

It's sad but there are more breeds out there like that, with people who want nothing to do with new folks and some try very hard to push everyone away that isn't in their "clique". I remember when I first started in Bulldogs, it took over a year before most would even make eye contact with us let alone say hello. Since then I make sure that new people are approached and welcomed by ou

07-24-2007, 09:04 AM	#1 (permalink)
PawNclaws Labrador Crazy Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: North West Posts: 1,897 Blog Entries: 2 Rep Power: 108	WHY ? kind of a Rant Now this may seem all mixed, possibly not making to much sense.. So forgive me.... Anyhoo, I've seen it on allot of websites about breeding. I've seen it on GP and I've been told by 2 Lab breeders - DON'T breed your dog, if he/she was not produced by a Ch.(sire or dam) or comes from a pedigree w/4 or more "titled dogs". Now I am aware that I may get jumped on for this, but I think I have got to express this. I've noticed quite a few Labs, especially imports but also Labs bred in the states,in a few breeding programs, have few "Titles" behind them- some NOT all have 2, 3 or even 5. Yet they are owned by respectable breeders, so no-one makes a fuss. If they had been owned by, lets say a novice and no-one knew who bred them, the owner(I) would get the "get him/her fixed" speech from a few Lab breeders b/c the pedigree isn't good enough. I know, I've been bashed b/c of me wanting to show Beau. 2 "Breeders" say "he's unlikely to be show quality" b/c of his pedigree- these breeders I have NOT met nor have then ever seen a good picture of nor have the personally seen Beau. Did I get angry - you betcha ! I was NOT aware that the 3rd Gen. doesn't count. What about the 2nd ? who cares, he wasn't produced by a Ch. right ! Well quite frankly I'm sick and tired of getting slapped in the face and put down by a few snobs who think only good dogs come from Champions and Ch. filled pedigrees. Well, they are dead wrong and it will be a cold day in He!! when I start listening to them ! NOW I am NOT saying all breeders are like this. I don't want to single out the two breeders above, it would be wrong. Just know that I am only talking about the breeders who put me down. Conclusion : Unless your a seasoned breeder, it's NOT ok to breed a dog that did not come from a Ch. ; 3 Gen. is "to far back" - " they don't count" ... even if your dog meets the requirements in breeding, if the dog wasn't bred out of Ch.s it's not good enough ! Even though I'm unsure of Beau's breeding future(I've not really thought about it) ... he has a pedigree that matches up to many labs in a few other programs - I have a mentor(2 actually) - and Beau will be Health Screed for Hips, Elbows , Eye's and Heart .... But WHY still, did I get put down for wanting to show him ; for me wanting to try to gain a few titles in the future; to gain experience handling with the "big dogs" ; to HAVE FUN !.. WHY did these 2 feel they needed to crush my hopes and dream of Showing Beau. WHY ?? Maybe it's me, maybe they just don't think I'm good enought to be in "their world".... What is it they don't like ? is it my views , that I think breeding 2 to 3 litters every year is to many ?, that breeding a litter, only to place all of them on limited Reg. is wrong ? believing that a conformationally and mentally sound dog, CAN come from a not-so-Ch. filled- pedigree ? possibly because I DO answer peoples questions, and I DO pay attention to ALL of them ? because I don't think a CH. means a whole H.E. Double-hocky-sticks of allot if the dog isn't proven else where ? maybe because I'm YOUNG and, they think stupid ? Who knows ! I just know what they said that day, was wrong and out of line ..
	__________________ Last edited by PawNclaws : 07-24-2007 at 09:43 AM.

07-24-2007, 09:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
SpringerLover Rascal Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Midwest Posts: 466 Rep Power: 51	Well, theoretically, they're correct. Did he come from health tested lines? Did he come from a responsible breeder? Do you KNOW his background in and out? When the breeders didn't breed with cation, it IS irresponsible to breed the offspring, no matter HOW great the dog is. It's a shaky line, but one I stick to the safe side of. There are way too many unknowns when breeding a dog that you don't know the absolute in and outs of in a pedigree. One that you can't ask for unbiased opinions of the sire/dam and further back. I would never breed a dog from an irresponsible breeder, like I said, no matter HOW 'good' the dog is.
	__________________ http://arohaspringer.blogspot.com

07-24-2007, 10:36 AM	#6 (permalink)
aquarian215 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 269 Rep Power: 33	Who cares what others say, if you want to show your dog, do it, and good luck, some people just like to give opinions when they are not asked for one, don't let it get to you, smile and nod, and then do whatever you feel is best.
	__________________

07-24-2007, 12:08 PM	#8 (permalink)
trainingrixie Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: jax, fla Posts: 746 Rep Power: 54	i say...screw those 2 breeders and anyone else who wants to hold you and beau back from showing. go for it!!
	__________________

07-24-2007, 12:57 PM	#9 (permalink)
IceyBlueSibes Eyes = Mirror to the soul Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Jupiter, Fla. Posts: 7,664 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 268	I'm with Cdn mom on this one -- I never interpreted the fact that you wanted to breed him directly after showing. I know you're better than that I've known for a long time about you talking about what you and your mom would like to do in the future. I think showing Beau is YOUR choice. The breeders have no right to tell you not to show him, even if his pedigree is not worthy. Breeding is a completely different story, which is something you didn't mention doing, and only the fact you want to show him. I think it would be a good start to learn how to handle a dog in the ring. So, I say go for it if you want to! I don't see anything wrong with it, because what else is going to happen? If you show Beau, and he's not a good specimen -- well then that's something you'd find out, wouldn't it If you did achieve a title to his name, that's when I would look at his pedigree. Isn't it true though that some breeders dislike others?
	__________________ Sheiba, Denali, Ike, Nitro (Siberian Husky), Kelso (GSD x), Lugar (Boxer/Pit x), Willah (Shepherd/Husky x), Tibby, Cheech, Chong (Chihuahua), and any foster we have in the house! 9 Kitty cats!

07-24-2007, 09:36 AM	#3 (permalink)
LilacDragon Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 283 Rep Power: 54	First off - let me start by saying that Labradors (in all of their glorious colors) are the most popular dog registered with AKC. Some 10,000 more labrador puppies are registered yearly then the second most popular breed (which slips my mind at this moment). RIGHT NOW, there are 26,280 labradors listed on Petfinder. As you may or may not know, Petfinder lists somewhere between 50% and 75% of the homeless dog in the U.S. IMHO - making sure that your dog meets the standard is a VERY important step in the breeding process. Therefore, your puppy should come from Championship parents. Does this mean you shouldn't show him - heck no! Go ahead! Pay the fees and soak up the experience. But remember - getting a championship is expensive and time consuming. You have a male dog, don't you? While you may well show him to his championship - please remember that the owner of the bitch will be looking at the whole package. Not just his Championship but his pedigree. What his lines have produced is VERY important. While your dog may have his title and all of his health clearances, what about his siblings, his parents and their siblings, their parents and their siblings? When I go looking at a breeder to get a puppy from - the first thing I will be looking at is titles and health clearances on the parents. Then I will be looking at lines. And if there is a dog or two in the pedigree that don't have a championship - then I will expect the breeder to be able to tell me why that particular dog was used. IE. - this dog was beautiful specimen of the breed but the owner was concentrating more on schutzhund or French ring training. The dog was used for breeding to add drive to the lines. Sorry, but there are soooooo many labs out there and soooo many are put to sleep every single year that I don't think that just having a championship is a good reason to breed.

07-24-2007, 11:02 AM	#7 (permalink)
CdnRottieMom Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 218 Rep Power: 31	Just read your post and I never got the idea that you wanted to breed Beau, but I can see how some of the others may have been mistaken. Majority of people who show their dogs, do so to eventually breed them. If you want to show Beau and get him health tested, then I say go ahead and do it. It is costly though, the expenses of dog shows and training (agility, dog sports, etc...) do add up. In the end it will be fun for both you and Beau, and you'll have that experience behind you.

07-24-2007, 02:22 PM	#10 (permalink)
borzoimom Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 192 Rep Power: 0	The problem lies in the 26,000 something that need homes in a already popular breed.. Lets compare here- Borzois had like 695 registered last year to how many 10 grand + of Labs? Showing is to determine breeding stock- thats the whole purpse of it. And while you can excellent lines but the dogs are not titled themselves for whatever reasons, with the massive amount of a breed in shelters across the US, instead of more pups- adopt what is already out there..
borzoimom Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 192 Rep Power: 0

07-24-2007, 04:14 PM	#11 (permalink)
IceyBlueSibes Eyes = Mirror to the soul Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Jupiter, Fla. Posts: 7,664 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 268	That may be the intended purpose of confirmation, but there are many out there who still do it just for fun. I was actually interested in enrolling Sheiba in shows, via the "breeders" were willing to change her registration, but she had already been spayed, so I was unable to do so. I would have never done it for breeding -- just for fun. Paws - I would just ignore the comments about breeding, as this is not what you were mentioned you were going to do. Many are assuming you're going to if you show Beau. As I said in my first post, I'd go ahead and show him no matter what others say. If you have the time and money to do so, I see nothing wrong with it.
	__________________ Sheiba, Denali, Ike, Nitro (Siberian Husky), Kelso (GSD x), Lugar (Boxer/Pit x), Willah (Shepherd/Husky x), Tibby, Cheech, Chong (Chihuahua), and any foster we have in the house! 9 Kitty cats!

07-24-2007, 06:13 PM	#12 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 282	I guess I'm not exactly sure how this turned into a breeding issue right off the bat or how the amount of labs available currently on pet finder has anything to do with you wanting to show your boy but, like has already been mentioned - I guess I can see where someone might assume. After all, conformation showing is about the evaluation of breeding stock and yes there may be a possibility of your boy not only doing well in the ring but one day possibly being used for breeding purposes but - that isn't the issue at hand right now. There are breeders out there that would not only prefer but refuse to breed anything that doesn't have a title in front of it first however, in my opinion not always does the title make the brood bitch or sire and I can list many champions who came from an untitled sire, dam or both! Bottom line in my opinion, if your boy meets the standard and you want to show him then it doesn't matter how far back in his pedigree a title is or isn't.....what matters is your boy, in the show ring, being judged against a set standard and thats that. Politics can be a very cruel and unforgiving master and not one that I would venture to tie myself to.
	__________________ Get more out of Global Paw. Check out these great features. Global Paw Book Club -- Art Classes -- Woof Review I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~ Gerry Spence As a member of Global paw staff my opinions are not necessarily those of the website or the owner.

07-24-2007, 06:51 PM	#13 (permalink)
PawNclaws Labrador Crazy Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: North West Posts: 1,897 Blog Entries: 2 Rep Power: 108	Oh I'm still going to show him- nothing they can say can stop me. I just had to get that out there. I just find it wrong that they actually tried stopping me from showing. I thought they wanted people out there doing fun things with their dogs ? For me, it happends to be shows. What if they did/ do this to some one very much new, with their first Lab- it's sad to even think about how hurt they would be. I just don't agree with people putting others down like that... It really put an impression on me that not all breeders welcome new comers into the show world easily.. I wasn't really expecting to get bashed...for wanting to show Crossfire,. I expect the worst, but I really want to show, so I'm prepared.. He's my only boy and he will be the last male I even get- it's been an experiance and I can't imagine how the next 16 years are going to be- fun I know !.. I love him dearly and I want to share the excitment with him that the show ring offers. If he never places, it's not the end of the world or if he doesn't enjoy him self, well he'll be neutered and we'll see about other sports. I want handling skills and I want to enjoy my fav. sport with Beau and, later, Bella..... Well I've had him looked over. He's OK , but he's growing so things can still pop up.. A few flaws are his feet and he's a bit high in the rear, not by much but you can see it . I've not really had any one go over him recently though , but I don't plan to until his first show. I want to see what a judge thinks of him. I already know he's gorgeous but all dogs are gorgeous in their owners eye's ..
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07-25-2007, 07:38 AM	#14 (permalink)
Crossfire Bulldogs Sourmug Mom Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Snuggled Between The Snorts & Snores. Posts: 7,844 Blog Entries: 3 Rep Power: 282	I think it's terrible when someone, anyone, in any breed attempts to discourage a person from wanting to learn and show. Those that do not only fail to realize that someone has to "take over" the breed after their gone but that in pushing new people away their hurting the breeds future. As the old saying goes, want something done right then do it yourself. Those that whine and moan over new folks coming into the ring should be taking the time to teach them how it's done. Leave a legacy for your breed not a hindurance. It's sad but there are more breeds out there like that, with people who want nothing to do with new folks and some try very hard to push everyone away that isn't in their "clique". I remember when I first started in Bulldogs, it took over a year before most would even make eye contact with us let alone say hello. Since then I make sure that new people are approached and welcomed by our kennel because I remember how it felt to be the outsider. We were determined that no one was going to stop us from showing and I applaud you for wanting to do the same. Stick to it and go for it!
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