non akc breeds

[TribalRats]

I also did want to metion (because this is the reason this thread was started) that even though Rat Terriers are not AKC recognized they are not int he misc breeds category here, they are in the Terrier category.
So, while I find the AKC discussion very interesting I guess I can not complain that ny UKC dog was placed in misc.

[rutylr]

[quote=Crossfire Bulldogs]Heres my question though - Is it in fact the AKC that makes the difference on the population levels as well as the dog being bred differently in your opinions?

I would have to say yes.Once they are AKC recognized people see them and want them.
As with the Glens they have been around for years and never really had this big a problem.
Donna

[rutylr]

I have even run into some people who have told me that showing in UKC is like not showing at all because the only real dogs are AKC dogs. Some people are nuts.


I get that alot also.I would rather go to a UKC show then an AKC show.(the people are nicer).
There use to only be 5 shows a year here in WI,but because so many AKC owner/handlers are getting sick of being beat by handlers(which are not allowed in UKC)they are coming to UKC.The shows have gotten so big we get done about 7 at night.Now more and more clubs are starting to offer UKC shows.
So for them to say real dogs only show in AKC is wrong as alot are going UKC.
Donna

[Crossfire Bulldogs]

Well I'm glad to see that it appears most here aren't under the impression that the registry is responsible for the standard.

While I do understand that there are several breeds that have been "ruined" by current standards which seem to rely on appearance more than what the dog was originally bred for it always amazes me when someone is so quick to blame that on the registry instead of where the blame should go.

[Kade]

I agree that there is something to the idea that breeders can sell more dogs because they are AKC... of course, we have all seen the people who post here and say, "How can I register my Doodleman Pinscher? The breeder said I can get papers from the National Doodle-rama Kennel Club," or some such representation. So a breeder can always claim that a dog is registerable or has papers, regardless of whether the AKC is involved or not.

I am of the opinion, however, that irresponsible exposure of these dogs is, in many cases, more to blame than the fact that they are registered with the AKC (and I do not attribute this to the televised AKC events). The movie "The Mask" and the TV show "Frasier" did more to harm the JRT than belonging to any registry ever could have! Not to mention shows like "That's My Baby" that ultimately glorify BYBs.

And the same thing, IMO, is about to happen with French Bulldogs. Everybody on TV has one, so everybody wants one. I have already this year met with a poorly-bred Frenchy who, unfortunately, seemed a mark of things to come.

I am pretty well AKC entrenched, as you may sense. But I do think it's a great idea to include those other legitimate breeds in their own legitimate forum -- at the very least, it will keep people from thinking, "Well, if that Cane Corso is a breed, so is my Jackapoo!"

[TribalRats]

I am of the opinion, however, that irresponsible exposure of these dogs is, in many cases, more to blame than the fact that they are registered with the AKC (and I do not attribute this to the televised AKC events). The movie "The Mask" and the TV show "Frasier" did more to harm the JRT than belonging to any registry ever could have! Not to mention shows like "That's My Baby" that ultimately glorify BYBs.

That is a very good point Kade. Very good. Everything in moderation maybe...

[Chelsea]

Maybe I'm missing something but...who said that the breeds discussed in those areas HAD to be AKC accepted? If you have an Grand Bleu de Gasgcone and want to talk about it, just talk about it in the hound group. It's not AKC-accepted, but it's a hound.

And, imho, I don't think the AKC ruins breeds - breeders do. Judges do. Breed clubs do. Yes, the AKC appoints these judges and accepts the standards of the breed club, but the AKC is just a registry. It's the clubs' responsibility to educate the judges on what is correct and what isn't, and the breeders' responsibility to look past the ribbons and the glory and breed for the future of the breed, not the BIS that's just out of their grasp.

[TribalRats]

I don't think anyone is blaming the AKC for ruining the breed (at least I am not), it is just the added exposure that the AKC brings to a breed that I believe some of us are commenting on.
It is a contributer to public demand. Hightened public demand makes it much more appealing to a BYB or a puppymill who supplies a pet store to breed dogs that are high on the public demand list. I am not saying that only AKC dogs are high on that list there are many designer dogs that are FAR from AKC recognized. My point is simply that with AKC recognition there will be more exposure and more opportunity for the breed to be exploited by those with less then honorable intentions.

[Crossfire Bulldogs]

I can agree with that for the most part Tribal but do think that movies and things of that nature play a bigger role than what a registry does.

The biggest reason I'm less than thrilled with my DDB being recognized by AKC is because of the enforcement issues, the AKC has no backbone to enforce rules already in place yet wants to add more? They also have been known to do a few things that I am VERY against like taking money from the Hunte Corp.

[Raised By Wolves]

I'm not involved in any show or AKC activities myself. But I do watch the dog shows on TV whenever I can. I don't believe these are all AKC. Some of them are European shows. This is where many people including myself, get to see many different breeds of purebred dogs. I can see how someone might pick one of these dogs, based on what they look like rather than if that breed might or might not be a got match for their family or personality.

It would be nice to know there are responsible breeders out there, like many we have here at the Paw. But people who are determined to get that dog which has been made a fad by the media or looks good in the show ring, are already primed and ready to get one from a BYB, if they can't get one from a legit breeder.

[TribalRats]

Great points Crossfire and Raised by Wolves. I agree with both of you. It will be interesting to see what takes place after out Fss turns Full in the AKC standings.

[Jamilupine]

Okay, I read through this whole thread and at times felt I was reading greek! Can you please define these for me?
BYB?
DDB?
UKC?
FSS?

Okay, to add my two cents! I agree with Kade with respect to exposure the dog gets!
I think that there is potential for any dog to become a fad - AKC recognized or not. Also, I agree with someone else who posted here about posting your dog based on what they were originally breed for, regardless of AKC recognization. Just do it, it makes sense and who is AKC really to tell us that a non-recognized dog is not good enough to make it into one of the groups?! It just means they are too snobby to accept some really great breeds.
(as a side note - my dog is AKC registered! But I love all dogs, any breed, with or without AKC's approval. I would pay the same amount for an AKC approved dog from well bred lines as I would a non-recognized dog from equally well bred lines. I just want a happy healthy dog!)

[Crossfire Bulldogs]

Here you go

BYB = Back Yard Breeder
DDB = Dogue de Bordeaux
UKC = United Kennel Club
FSS = Foundation Stock Service

[Chelsea]

Jamilupine, the AKC doesn't not accept breeds because they're "snobby". They put a lot of thought into what breeds are and aren't accepted. It's a lengthy process, and rightfully so, imho. If they accepted any and every breed that they were asked to, they'd be no better than the Con. Kennel Club, with pekapoos and labradoodles. ^^ If you look at their FSS page, there are quite a few breeds that are being gone over, and there are several breeds in their Miscellaneous class a few years away from acceptance. It's an almost neverending process - there are so many breeds out there, and a lot of them may be highly popular in their homelands but hardly existant in the US. There's no point in accepting a breed if there aren't enough dogs to attend shows. There have to be a certain amount of dogs of that particular breed in the US, then they can be reviewed and revised for acceptance.

[elegy]

they won't accept labradoodles and such because they're not breeds.

however, they would not accept the american pit bull terrier because they did not want the reputation of pit dogs assosciated with their name. they changed the name to american staffordshire terrier, and while it's fundamentally the same breed, it is acceptable to them, while the pit bull is not. go figure. the pit bull is a very popular breed with a solid breed standard and a long history in the us, but it will never be an akc breed.

personally i wouldn't care, but it caused me a lot of anxiety over whether they'd accept my pit bull as an am staff for an ILP so that i could compete in their sports (they did, btw). if they'd open their sports up to mixed breed dogs or non-akc breeds, i could care less what they accept in the conformation ring, but that's a different rant for a different time, i suppose.